If you hold our hand out like your're going to pancake the horn with your palm, imagine your thumb being bent back so it touches your wrist and that's what happened. The EMTs at the scene who came up to me first even got a little light headed and had to go sit down, he was like... "yo why is your thumb all the way over there?" The bones were pressing up against the skin. I'd be more than happy to give you a pic of my banged up wrist for your wife Pierce if she needs anymore motivation! I'll have problems with that hand and wrist for the rest of my life.

 

I own 4 cars - an 04 Highlander, 95 850T wagon, 00 S40 and a 12 VW CC (guess which I drive...) owning each from new. Before that I had an 4000 Quattro which I did 300K miles on. The Quattro had a very similar FI set up to the 240s and proved to be very reliable with a set of typical fault areas (vacuum leaks, radiators) with Bosch parts common to VW, Mercedes, BMW, Saabs etc. My 850 has also proven reasonably easy to maintain with the exception of the AC and ABS. The S40 is fairly low miles but I'm about to change a broken front spring (already did rears after one broke) and had issues with the vacuum pump but that's it. Then you get to the Highlander - one strut failed and one climate control switch in 10 years /150K driving... So back to the post 97 Volvos - I'd avoid the early AWD models but the 01-02 V70s are solid. The emissions and FI/spark set up is very similar to Mercedes/BMW so there no saying one is more reliable. The FWD tranny is an Aisen, aka a "Toyota" transmission so they are strong. There has been some issues with software but that's a recall/upgrade fix if not done. The 01s moved to direct coils so its a good idea to replace the coil packs at 100K miles. The ACs tend to have clutch gap issues - a DIY fix by removing shims and some cars need the PCV system refreshed because a prior owner didn't change oil often enough. They still have the best seats in the business, if you buy the wagon you can fit a ton of stuff (more than an Audi or Merc - about the same as a Highlander). My net of all this based on working on my Audi and mom's 240 as well as the 850/S40 is that all cars got more complex in terms of maintenance and debug from 95 to 02 but once you learn how the new systems work and how to use the OBD2 codes its not much harder to maintain (just more tedious since some parts are buried under others - not like the older models).

 

I looked at Highlanders back when I was wealthy... I liked them but the seats were just not comfortable for me at all. I'd consider it but Toyota for me has the WORST seats in the car world.

I've only heard of horror stories when it comes to VW/Audi and electrical systems, now I'm not sure if that's been worked out or not on the newer models, my ex's best friend had an 02' VW and the entire electrical system needed to be replaced. They drive nice, and I just don't know the Audi line well enough, I could learn, but again I'm leary of them being VW's with expensive trim. I know they make specific models that are Audi only, especially their higher end, but the lower models seem to be Passat wagons in audi trim, please correct me if I'm wrong here.

When I see pics of all you folks in California and your OLD cars looking so nice, keep in mind I'm in CT. We're getting Nor'Easters here in winter now so severe every year that we're averaging almost 4-5' of snowfall, and usually a 2+ foot dump a year....rotting cars is a problem with all that salt on the roads.

I'd look at Passats again, I test drove one once for a LONG time and it killed my back, but I was in much worse shape back then too, hadn't healed broken vertebra, crushed discs, etc.

I'm going to look at a 2002 Saab 9-3 later today, with 146k miles for I think less than 2k, I LOVE those cars for drive and amenities, ergos, etc. but as I said my old '04 9-5 was a disaster for reliability. Everything went on it, ABS, you name it. All covered under a cert. pre owned warranty, but still doesn't inspire me with confidence.

I also back to the main question really, REALLY, covet the XC70's post '01. Seems like some of them just go and go, get 250k plus miles etc. and others seem to need everything done, engines, transmissions going. I guess it's just a gamble on those cars.

What to do... There's a 1990 760 wagon with 75k miles on it for 2k on Long Island. I might just go with what I know, we'll see.

 

A friend of mine has been driving 850's and loves them. He said you have to make sure they aren't blowing oil out the filler cap (indicates the blow-by unit is plugged, this eventually causes the main seal to fail). If that hasn't happened, then just replace the blow-by catch box, change the timing belt, fluids, etc. and they're good for 400k+ miles.

Think I might get me one for variety...

 

my 850T wagon had a trashed front end before it hit 200K miles, requiring repairs to the spring seats and strut towers, a new steering rack, new control arms. the interior was full of rattles, the clips that held the dashboard assembly to the chassis were cracked. CV joints were shot, too.

and, ugh, it was FWD, with all the torque steer weirdness that implies.

 

I tried a '96 850R back in the day as it looked great on paper (performance numbers and all that). Never had there been a more disappointing car.

The market is now full of $500 850/s70 with all kinds of issues all too expensive to be worth fixing--they can't give them away!

 

If you're following my other thread on my frustrating regina 940, I'm ready to just buy something that works.... Still, I'd be better off I think just getting the dang brick fixed and rolling again. I really want to like/buy one of the XC70s, and they're out there running and cheap, but ugh.

I may just get an '02 Saab hatchback, timing chain/not belt, well maintained... and it drives. Fix the brick as I have time and give the Saab to my girlfriend

 

I recommend a 9-3 or 900; the ECU on those is plug and play and doesn't need to be coded like the 9-5 (terrible car). Just keep an spare ignition cartridge in the back and you're good to go.

 

the classic saab 900 Turbo 2-door hatchback with a stick shift was a sweet car, we almost bought one new in the late 80s. I hardly ever see one anymore, so they are becoming rare. Maybe it will be a new classic?

of course, with any Saab, parts availability is a killer, there is no more Saab Inc, and the spare parts warehouses were scrapped.

 

My very first experience with a Swedish car was an '87 900S stick. That thing made me fall in love with Swedish cars, I still miss it. Locally the older 900s are going for about 3$k with 150-200k miles. And they're getting that price...you just need to stock up on those FRIKKEN HEADLINERS. Then I got a '94 940 wagon and likewise, fell in love. I'd have to look at the paper work, but I can't recall how many bricks or Saabs I've owned.

I bought an '04 95 cert. pre-owned, and thank Odin cause that thing needed about 7$k worth of work before the clock hit 100k miles, all covered but it was a mechanical disaster.

GM killed them. Wouldn't even let them have the Griffin logo back, they kept it when they sold off their holdings etc., when they 'almost' got bought like three times...then..poof. Gone. Killing the hatchback was the single dumbest thing they did.

There's a few Merc wagons available locally....

 

So my journey to the Dark Side is complete. I bought an '01 V70 wagon with 61k original miles for $2k. I couldn't pass it up. Old couple owned, it. Single owner, all service records. It needs a few things, like another car to be up and running when it starts blowing parts like a yugo but if it lasts another 30k miles it will be worth it, and it drives like a Cadillac, seats are SO nice....

 

Pierce, what specific years/models of Mercedes do you recommend as far as being the easiest (I.e. cheapest) to maintain and work on yourself? Unfortunately, my son wants no part of my 94' 940 when he gets his license in a few months. He has been looking at the Benz's on Craigslist. There is actually quite a variety of sub-$2K of them available. Also, what are the best resources online for do-it-yourselfer Benz owners?

 

there's nothing more expensive than a cheap mercedes. they are very service intensive cars, and considerably more complex and intricate to work on than the Volvos.

that said, my personal favorites are the 6 cylinder E series cars from the mid 80s to mid 90s, known as model W124 (trhats a internal code), including 300E, 300TE (wagon), early E320 (e320 model name got continued on the next generation cars). They have issues too, 92-97 mercedes had bad wiring harnesses (much like 80s volvos), although most of the ones on the road today probably got replaced. the automatic transmissions suffer from a premature reverse gear failure, a good rebuilt transmission can cost about $2800 installed. and the long straight 6 head gaskets are subject to early failure, but they'll usually seep coolant or oil for years before they actually fail completely. Oh, and the early 4Matic AWD system is to be avoided at all costs unless you're a master mechanic with full resources to work on it.

very important to A) get full service records on an older Mercedes, AND B) take it to a knowlegable older-mercedes-specific mechanic for a full PPI (typically costs about $100).

My 3 model 124's...


(left to right, a 1990 300E2.6 sedan, a 1994 E320 wagon, and a 1993 300CE Cabriolet)

frankly, I'd be looking at Toyota's and Hondas for cheap reliable transportation for your first-time driver.

 

Thanks for the insight Pierce. We are currently looking at a 1997 E-320 for $800. Not sure if that's a W124 model? It's listed as being in "excellent" condition, but does have high mileage and a cracked front bumper, which I'm hoping is why it's listed so cheap. I will ask if the issues u mentioned were ever addressed. I agree with the Honda/Toyota suggestion, but not as exciting for a teenager to show up in the High School parking lot with one of those. I figure as long as I have a shot at taking care of some of the basic maintenance/repair issues myself (service/check engine lights, tune-up, brakes, alternator, "bumper", water pumps, etc.) I'd be willing to take a chance for the $$.

 

thats the model that replaced the W124, I think they were called W210, with the oval plastic headlights that quicky turn yellow.

97 will have OBD-II diagnostics. I believe a 97 210 still uses the same M104 HFM-SFI engine (later years switched to a newer V6 engine), and its the last full year of the bad wiring harnesses so its critical to ensure the harnesses have been replaced. There's the main harness in the engine compartment, that takes a couple hours to replace, then a simpler 'starter' aka 'lower' harness, plus the wiring to the ETA/CC/ICS module (throttle body) which also goes bad.

I believe the W210's use an electronic controlled automatic transmission, if they do there will be a W/E/S(?) switch next to the shifter.... these transmissions are a lot more expensive to repair, but I don't know if they suffer from the same weak reverse clutch problem that the 4 speed W124 automatics do. The test is to fully up the car, stop on level ground, foot lightly on the brake, and shift from P or N to R, and note how long it takes for reverse to actually engage. 1-2 seconds is normal. if its much over 5 seconds, there's going to be a major transmission repair in your near future.

water pumps last a LONG time on M103/M104 engines, so do alternators. they use a timing chain rather than a belt, so there's no regular belt replacements. the serpentine accessory belt needs replacing periodically, along with its tensioner, except I think a 97 has a newer style tensioner that lasts longer. now, if you have the V6, I know *NOTHING* of these.

Its highly advisable to stick with real Mercedes parts for most everything as they have much better quality control than most aftermarket stuff. There's select stuff available aftermarket from the original manufacturer, for instance, Graf water pumps, Lemforder suspension arms, and so forth, these are generally OK, but stuff like Meyle, Uro is junk. So is a lot of what Bosch sells nowdays, sadly.


Do you really want to put a new driver in a 240HP car that goes 150MPH smoothly? phew. Personally, I'd vote for MINIMIZING excitement in that high school parking lot.

 

[QUOTE=pierce;421544]thats the model that replaced the W124, I think they were called W210, with the oval plastic headlights that quicky turn yellow.

97 will have OBD-II diagnostics. I believe a 97 210 still uses the same M104 HFM-SFI engine (later years switched to a newer V6 engine), and its the last full year of the bad wiring harnesses so its critical to ensure the harnesses have been replaced. There's the main harness in the engine compartment, that takes a couple hours to replace, then a simpler 'starter' aka 'lower' harness, plus the wiring to the ETA/CC/ICS module (throttle body) which also goes bad.

I believe the W210's use an electronic controlled automatic transmission, if they do there will be a W/E/S(?) switch next to the shifter.... these transmissions are a lot more expensive to repair, but I don't know if they suffer from the same weak reverse clutch problem that the 4 speed W124 automatics do. The test is to fully up the car, stop on level ground, foot lightly on the brake, and shift from P or N to R, and note how long it takes for reverse to actually engage. 1-2 seconds is normal. if its much over 5 seconds, there's going to be a major transmission repair in your near future.

water pumps last a LONG time on M103/M104 engines, so do alternators. they use a timing chain rather than a belt, so there's no regular belt replacements. the serpentine accessory belt needs replacing periodically, along with its tensioner, except I think a 97 has a newer style tensioner that lasts longer. now, if you have the V6, I know *NOTHING* of these.

Its highly advisable to stick with real Mercedes parts for most everything as they have much better quality control than most aftermarket stuff. There's select stuff available aftermarket from the original manufacturer, for instance, Graf water pumps, Lemforder suspension arms, and so forth, these are generally OK, but stuff like Meyle, Uro is junk. So is a lot of what Bosch sells nowdays, sadly.


Do you really want to put a new driver in a 240HP car that goes 150MPH smoothly? phew. Personally, I'd vote for MINIMIZING excitement in that high school parking lot.[/QUOTE

There is also a '93 300E w/200K miles available for the same $800. Better car? Also claims to be in excellent condition, but ad does state that a few "minor changes to electrical needed like the battery needs replacing". Sounds suspiciously like the harnesses you mentioned. Easy enough do-it-yourself fix? Expensive?

Believe me, I'd rather he drive the Volvo. Maybe I'll have to torture myself and switch cars with him for the first few months till I'm certain he can keep it under 125 mph at least. He's a pretty good kid though.

 

careful, mercedes are addictive that ratty looking gold 300E2.6 in my pic above was our 'free taste', after fixing a fuel injection problem it had, we decided it was SUCH a nice drive, I got my wife the white wagon to replace a Toyota she never liked, and then I ended up with the black Cabriolet just because. my poor 740 is being neglected, and feels like driving an old truck by comparision.

 

I'm in a similar spot. I still have four Red Blocks but have acquired a '94 e320, '02 SLK320, '98 E320 Wagon, and a '99 C43, just an '02 E55, and the '92 745 does feel a little tired but still serves as the preferred "dog car" as the dogs like it the best.

As far as the post 1995 Volvos, nah, they are dead to me. I had an '05 V50t5 with a stick but besides its great lines and artsy interior the materials and fit and finish were disappointing. I also have a couple of Passats which are much like a V50 only easier to live with. I like them because they are sticks and get terrific gas mileage (close to 40mpg with the 4cyl turbo. I see nothing in the future to entice me to look at a newer Volvo
I can see myself eventually going to all Mercedes to replace my Volvo addictions as the Red Blocks disappear gradually and age beyond serviceability.

 

W124s are sturdy as hell, the back seat is kinda tight as I recall...the kids bitched like crazy when I got a 300E to replace a big-body 420SEL...
The big thing with older MB cars is that their interior plastics are SO much nicer than Volvo interiors...rock solid, fewer squeaks and rattles, less prone to breakage. And if you can stand the idea of sitting on vinyl seats, MB Tex is an amazizngly durable material.

 

indeed, MB Tex (vinyl) is, IMHO, every bit as comfortable as 25 year old Volvo leather.

btw, in Germany, what us American's know as "MB Tex" is called "Taxi Leather" most european Mercedes have fabric seats, which were never sold in the US. the Taxi Leather was mostly used on commercial vehicles like taxicabs. Leather seating is fairly rare in Europe, only found on high end fully equipped cars that sold for a big premium. Here, like 1/2 the mercedes are in that latter category, although to be honest, US model W124's were pretty well equipped even as 'base' models (all US models have power seats, climate control, electric/vacuum locks, power windows, and so forth... all these things were options in .EU).

we've got a 1994 W124 wagon with 256000 miles, the drivers seat looks like new. stuff is durable as all heck.