Driving the '95 850 yesterday in Summit County, Colorado (high elevation might effect something with this story?) and suddenly the Oil Light came on. Well, on I-70 you can't really stop and check the oil anywhere that you could actually get oil - especially at with these small towns - no help. Watching the console and turning the radio off, I kept driving thinking that maybe i'm just a little low, i'll check it later. About 5-10 minutes later the car started to struggle up the hill, sounded un-natural, and when I gave it gas it just got louder and had almost no increase in power. The heat gauge was level however. I pulled off onto the side of the interstate and checked it out - oil was leaking from under the engine, and the oil pan (and surrounding areas) was covered in the oil. The oil filter was still there, the drain plug was fine, there was no smell of burning oil (beyond the expected oil that hit the manifold, as well as no increase in temperature - the engine was as hot as it would be normally. Had it towed in but won't get a mechanic to diagnose it until at least Tuesday - this being New Years Eve and the fact that a lot of small companies around here close on the 1st of the year as well. So i'll have 2 fun-filled days sitting around just thinking about it.

Given that description - I'm aware that it's probably a seal, and could be anything, but has anyone run into something similar? And, when the engine runs out of oil, in the case of a blown seal or damaged oil pan or something, is there anything to prevent SERIOUS damage? Would the system shut down with the increase in friction?

I really throws me off that there was an increase in friction, most definitely happens when you lose oil, but no increase in the engine's heat.

Help me understand what could have happened here - and if any major damage might have been caused.

 

Sounds kind of rough, anytime your oil light comes it is not a good thing, you basically dont have enough oil to maintain the proper oil preasure. Driving around in this state is very bad for your vehicle, even for a little. The best thing to do, is to shut the engine off. Even if you need someone to fetch some oil for you. Having said that you should try putting fresh oil in, and also replace the oil filter, get an oil change basically, see how the engine runs then, but if you said you were losing power, I am sorry to say it might be too late.

Best of luck.

 

I agree if you lost power it is usually to late.

 

Umm.... i'm not new to cars, or this car - sure, when the oil light comes on, it's a bad thing - sure you should pull over and put oil in - but that was not possible, not at that time of night, not this particular weekend, and not with the traffic at the time. Didn't need any lessons on "cars and oil" - thanks. Sorry if that sounds rude, but it does insult my intelligence.

The heart of the matter is - what would cause me to lose my oil in literally 5 minutes? Head gasket?

If it were already too late - wouldn't I have seen some smoke, or some loud sounds, or at least have the engine overheat on me? It was almost like it ran out of gas but crawling under the car you could see oil everywhere.

 

Did you feel like something hit the bottom of the car?
The seals usually won't blow out like that to loose that much oil in 5 minutes.
These cars won't always make noise when burning up the bearings.
But the lack of power leads to the though of the bearings heating up and starting to restrict the movement of the crank.

These bearings on the Volvo's will burn up pretty easy compaired to some of the other car lines out there.

I was not trying to insult you but I made the comment like that because these bearings burn up pretty quick.

I would almost say there might be a hole in the oil pan or the oil filter seal blew out.(The only one that would pump oil out that fast)

 

Hitting something - maybe, we've had 2 big snowstorms in the last week, losts of ice, snowdrifts, and potholes now that it's melting. And I had actually hit a pretty big pothole on the right side of the car before the oil light started to come on - not sure if it's just coincidence, or a cause though.

If the bearings were burning up and restricting the movement of the crank - is that how the engine "ceases"? And what is it like when an engine ceases - it just suddenly stops?

Thanks for the help. i do appreciate it.

 

Yes if it was totally burned up the engine would stop all together.
If you add oil and start it up and you DON'T hear knocking then it might be fine.
But if you hear knocking then the bearings are burn't up pretty bad.

 

Hello Mr. TacklaNHL,

Greetings from Chicagoland.

Before I start, please note that none of my opinion is meant to insult your intelligence, and I am not as skilled/knowledgeable as Moderator Mr. Tech, so I'll just provide my prejudice.

If the coolant temp gauge stayed at 3 O'clock, the good news is that the engine may not have suffered significant damage, or just the bearings as Mr. Tech has noted. Also, an overheating engine is usually noted by coolant temp gauge registering in red zone, coolant overflow, severe knocking, loss of power (this one you noted)and the piston rings and cylinder liners ultimately bind due to red-hot. But I believe you already knew these things, so please ignore if so. Assuming from your description, I believe the engine did not suffer extensive damage, except the bearings.

High elevation should not affect this situation, but the thin air may affect engine output, except a turboed engine wouldn't get affected much.

I had a similar situation, though not exactly like your case. In my case, it was the oil cooler line that was leaking oil, from the oil thermostat housing area (right by the crank pulley). If something around there was loose, going over bumps might have disconnected something. Was the oil filter tight, by the way?

If you correct the leak, add new oil and if there is no problem, great. But if there is a problem, please provide us with detailed description so someone may be able to help you.

I wish you the best,


JPN

 

That was very helpful - thanks. Yes, I checked the oil filter - it was tightly secured. The bearings... that does seem like a serious repair. Currently the car is sitting on the street after it was towed - I haven't added oil to it because I figure it'll just leak right out again - I mean, it did leak all of the oil out when it went dead. If I had access to a lift I would be able to fill it with oil and then see exactly where it leaks out - that's where my mechanic will come in tomorrow. That should be interesting.

Is it possible to replace the bearings? If that is indeed the damage that was done?

What's really scary is that when the tow-truck guy dropped off the car he says to me "you know it won't start right? I tried to start it to roll it on the truck." - WHAT? WHY? How many times does someone call a tow-truck if the car is running? Why would he try to do that? INSANE! So who knows what extra damage that caused....

So what i'm looking at now is trying to repair the problem that caused the oil loss - and then repairing the damage that was done. How serious is a bearing repair in this case? Would that involve pulling the engine? Should I consider having my mechanic look for any other potential problem areas/maintenance while he's in there?

Oh by the way - i've head a couple people mention to me that it could have been a problem with the timing belt - but I just replaced that 15K ago - could a timing belt problem have caused this? I've never heard of a timing belt going bad after a year - but i guess it could happen - in your opinion, how likely do you think that would be?

Thanks for all the help - I am so appreciative of the time it takes to help me.

 

Didn't mean to insult ya, nobody really knows the xtent of other people's car knowledge. However, this may cheer you up. A friend of mine decided to do an oil change and tranny flush at the same time on his Explorer. He forgot to put the oi in . After an astonoshing 15 minutes of running with no oil, he realized what happened and put a fresh batch in. The engine ran, but it was really loud and lacked power, but it ran.

Anyhoo the fact that your engine won't start doesn't necessarily mean the worse. I had an air conditioner pulley seaze on me and my engine wouldn't turn over. So if your bearings are shot that might be the cause of the no start. If that is the case other things in your engine might also have been damaged,in this is the case you may want to look at a used engine swap, it may be cheaper than replacing a bunch of burnt out parts on this one.

By the way, those oil cooler lines love to leak out oil, but usually not at that rate, unless you may have hit something underneath.

Best of luck.

 

Hello again Mr. TacklaNHL,

850's seem to have certain oil-leak favourite locations. Some seals, O-rings, gaskets, turbocharger, etc... but not as bad as leaking all oil in 5 minutes. As Mr. Tech has noted, there could be a hole in the oil pan or other oil passages. Next time when you start the engine, watch the colour of exhaust gas. If it's bluish or smell antifreeze, the head gasket may have been damaged. I hope thiswill not be the case. Anyway, why not buy a quart of cheapest oil and pour it in the engine to see where the leak is.

I just checked the bearing replacement procedure in Haynes' manual and it does seem a heavy maintenance, requiring removal of the head and intermediate section of the cylinder block (but the engine removalshould not be necessary).People likeMr. Tech may be able to give you specific procedure.

>Is it possible to replace the bearings? If that is indeed the damage that was done?
Yes, they should be.

>Why would he try to do that? INSANE!
I agree. I once had an Accord towed and the young fellow ended up damaging the rearcontrol arm. I made his shop pay for the repair, though. Some towing guys have no clue about cars, even if the company is AAA-approved, so watch out!

It is extremely unlikely that it was caused by the timing belt. Unless the belt was soaked in oil or mishandled during installation, which weakens the belt, the belt should last at least 5 years/70,000 miles. The camshaft seals may develop minor oil leak, but not as bad as leaking all oil in 5 minutes. Also, if it was the timing belt, you would have noticed poor engine performance or engine dying after clashing of valves & pistons before your incident.

I hope there has been no damage, or even if there is, I hope it's something minor. The worst scenario is indeed the bearings but they are replaceable, check with a shop to see how much they charge. Also, when servicing Volvo, I wouldn't have repairs done at generic garages, I would definitely take it to a Volvo dealer or a shop that specializes in Swedish/European cars. They charge more, but the extra cost is well worth it.

Lastly, I would change the coolant (antifreeze) as well, after all repairs are done.

I wish you the best of luck.


JPN

 

That is promising - and yea, i've considered that an engine swap might be the better route - in the event that the $$ is up there. We'll see - as soon as my mechanic knows something - i'll post it here. Who knows - maybe it's something I can do myself [crossing fingers].

Thanks for the help!

 

No way on the timing belt causing it.

If just the Rod bearings are burn't then they could be changed easily with just dropping the pan.

But if it is the Main bearings I would to the engine swap and save the old engine and install ALL new bearings later. That will give you a spare engine incase something happens later.

 

Ok... the verdict is in!!

Engine is ceased - cause is unknown - damage is unknown - i'm having the mechanic investigate that as we speak, but the fact of the matter is that the engine is ceased and will need to be replaced.

The mechanic has located an engine with 89K miles on it for $900 and will charge me $850 for the labor - $1750 total - how does that sound?

I'm just not sure yet if I'm going to do it - but it does sound like a reasonable option.

What kind of things should I consider replacing, or at least looking into, while we're replacing the engine. I'm thinking clutch (any idea how much that will cost for a '95 850?), the timing belt (of course), and perhaps having the fuel injection cleaned are things i'm going to want to have done. Any other suggestions?

Hoses, belts, fluids are other things i'm going to have to replace right? Any idea on the total cost of these?

I want to thank everyone for their help with this matter - it has been a very stressful time for me, but your help makes all the difference!

 

Woops - automatic transmission has no clutch.

Calling a volvo specialist he suggests I replace the rear crankshaft, the timing belt, and the water pump.

Found another engine with 57K on it for $1150 - which is $250 more but 32 miles less - a good thing.

Your experienced opinions?

 

I would go for the engine for $800.00.
These engine will last to like 300,000 or so usually.
Sounds like you have all the other stuff covered on what to change.
Maybe a thermostat as well.

 

Tech - you're the man to ask on this next one - on the timing belt, water pump, thermostat, and rear crankshaft seal - I want to save the money by providing my mechanic the parts that I need - I know how they operate "$100 for the timing belt", when it actually costs $25.

Can I go with the non-OEM options and save the money? And have you ever found a good website that sells these OEM parts at a great price? Do I need to provide my mechanic with the timing belt kit - or just the belt?

 

Check with him about installing the parts you get.
Some charge double labor since you aren't using their parts.
Also some won't warranty the work either if you don't use their parts.

This is about the best site for OEM or close to Oem parts. Oem are usually specified next to the brand name and will look kind of like this Conitnental belt (OEM).
http://www.swedishpartswholesale.com/

 

Another one for you - while looking around for parts I see things like "for engine 131035" and then other "131XXX" #'s - what in the world?

 

You need to make sure they specify engine# or chassis number.
On the timing cover is an engine#.
That would make a difference sometimes for like the timing belt ETC.