In addition to flame trap what....
#21
07-15-2010, 01:50 AM
Banned
The 240's usually have pressure built up because of a blocked oil seperator or what a lot of newbs call a "breather box". You can check this by removing your flame trap hose...the bottom of the hose is connected to the oil seperator. With a flashlight look down into the nipple of the oil seperator. Does it look like a clogged artery? then ot needs to be removed and replace. NEVER push the built up down into trhe oil seperator or use pipe cleaners to try and clean. This just pushes the carbon/oil build up down into the seperator and clogs it more...So 99% you have a clogged oil seperator 1% you have bad rings/ bad motor...check your oil seperator first. Also. not that this will help reduce system pressure...but I always use 20W50 in my shop on B230F motors...now I would not suggest this if you have harsh winters...here in Seattle we do not we have very mild winters never gets lower than 30 F.
#22
07-15-2010, 01:57 AM
Banned
I just wanted to add something to this thread.
My 93-245 with 183k on it leaks a bit out of the oil cap,...I have cleaned most of the engine, especially wiping around the oil cap. There is NO leakage from the front cam seals (none what so ever, it is dry), but after about 15 miles of driving...I notice that there is fresh "mist" (if I can call it that) leaking from the oil cap.
I just replaced the flame trap and 1/2in hose from IPD, but that didn't seem to help. (the old trap was dirty..but not actually "clogged")
The car doesn't smoke as far as I can tell, but I have to put in about 1/2 quart every 1500 miles or so. It doesn't drip any oil on the ground either..so I'm sort of stumped.
From what I've read, the oil trap could be clogged,...or I might have another leak somewhere else?
Should I try the Kerosene trick?
My 93-245 with 183k on it leaks a bit out of the oil cap,...I have cleaned most of the engine, especially wiping around the oil cap. There is NO leakage from the front cam seals (none what so ever, it is dry), but after about 15 miles of driving...I notice that there is fresh "mist" (if I can call it that) leaking from the oil cap.
I just replaced the flame trap and 1/2in hose from IPD, but that didn't seem to help. (the old trap was dirty..but not actually "clogged")
The car doesn't smoke as far as I can tell, but I have to put in about 1/2 quart every 1500 miles or so. It doesn't drip any oil on the ground either..so I'm sort of stumped.
From what I've read, the oil trap could be clogged,...or I might have another leak somewhere else?
Should I try the Kerosene trick?
#23
07-15-2010, 01:59 AM
Banned
Here is an update on this thread. I am writing this in hopes that it may benefit someone else who might find themselves with similar issues.
Recapping: My 1990 240DL developed a front crank seal leak. My mechanic cleaned the flametrap, adjacent hoses and replaced the front crank seal (noting that he thought I might have excessive crank play - he tried three seals, finally using an OEM seal, but it still leaked - but much slower). About 500 miles later I blew out a rear cam seal. The front crank seal leak had also been increasing in volume. My mechanic replaced the rear cam seal and noticed that it looked like one of the seals under the timing belt cover was also leaking - oil was slowly seeping around the middle cover screw. This is where I started this thread - looking for sources other than the flametrap for excessive crankcase pressure. Blue Goose suggested to look at the oil separator so I decided I might as well replace the entire flametrap system as a way to eliminate that as the potential source of my problem.
I got a good deal on the parts at FCP Groton and my mechanic did the dirty work. Looking at the old parts I see I had the old metal style flametrap and that it was already pretty well clogged with a oily, sooty mess - only 700 miles after it was cleaned. The new flametrap is the plastic style - I would have replaced the metal one when it was previously cleaned but did not know better at the time.
Posts are alway much better when there are pictures so here are a couple of pics I took of the old oil separator that I cut into two pieces.
The left picture is looking at the bottom of the separator. The hole to the left leads to the crankcase return tube, the hole second from the right is the "in" from the top of the crankcase. Notice that the "in" hole is a separate small, curvy section. The flow of pressure goes from the left side, thru the squeezed-down curvy area and to the right side where it flairs alittle bigger. The other two holes are for mounting. The picture on the right is top section. Remember the flaired area I just mentioned, well, although you can't see it in the picture, there is a passage way thru the wall from the flaired area that leads to the large center cavity. The passage way is fairly small and only goes thru the wall near the top of the separator. You can see all the surfaces are covered with a decent layer of oily-sooty, gritty grime. Although I did not see anything clogged, that layer of grime looks like it restricts the squeezed-in area of the curvy section. But then again, the separator is quite tall so I really don't think that flow was appreciably restricted here.
Immediately after the flametrap system replacement I saw no oil seeping from the timing belt cover bolt and that ground-droppings from the splash pan (collection point for the leak from front crank seal) had become extremely small. A couple hundred miles later, seeping did return to the timing belt screw and the ground-droppings have slightly increased. I pulled the new flametrap to see if something had already started to clog it, but it was still very clean. I still have not eliminated piston ring blow-by as a source for excessive crank pressure - if it's still there. I am thinking that if I was getting compression blow-by, then I would see evidence of carbon or some kind of build-up on the flametrap. Does anyone support or disagree with this thinking? Maybe I just need to replace leaking seals.
Recapping: My 1990 240DL developed a front crank seal leak. My mechanic cleaned the flametrap, adjacent hoses and replaced the front crank seal (noting that he thought I might have excessive crank play - he tried three seals, finally using an OEM seal, but it still leaked - but much slower). About 500 miles later I blew out a rear cam seal. The front crank seal leak had also been increasing in volume. My mechanic replaced the rear cam seal and noticed that it looked like one of the seals under the timing belt cover was also leaking - oil was slowly seeping around the middle cover screw. This is where I started this thread - looking for sources other than the flametrap for excessive crankcase pressure. Blue Goose suggested to look at the oil separator so I decided I might as well replace the entire flametrap system as a way to eliminate that as the potential source of my problem.
I got a good deal on the parts at FCP Groton and my mechanic did the dirty work. Looking at the old parts I see I had the old metal style flametrap and that it was already pretty well clogged with a oily, sooty mess - only 700 miles after it was cleaned. The new flametrap is the plastic style - I would have replaced the metal one when it was previously cleaned but did not know better at the time.
Posts are alway much better when there are pictures so here are a couple of pics I took of the old oil separator that I cut into two pieces.
The left picture is looking at the bottom of the separator. The hole to the left leads to the crankcase return tube, the hole second from the right is the "in" from the top of the crankcase. Notice that the "in" hole is a separate small, curvy section. The flow of pressure goes from the left side, thru the squeezed-down curvy area and to the right side where it flairs alittle bigger. The other two holes are for mounting. The picture on the right is top section. Remember the flaired area I just mentioned, well, although you can't see it in the picture, there is a passage way thru the wall from the flaired area that leads to the large center cavity. The passage way is fairly small and only goes thru the wall near the top of the separator. You can see all the surfaces are covered with a decent layer of oily-sooty, gritty grime. Although I did not see anything clogged, that layer of grime looks like it restricts the squeezed-in area of the curvy section. But then again, the separator is quite tall so I really don't think that flow was appreciably restricted here.
Immediately after the flametrap system replacement I saw no oil seeping from the timing belt cover bolt and that ground-droppings from the splash pan (collection point for the leak from front crank seal) had become extremely small. A couple hundred miles later, seeping did return to the timing belt screw and the ground-droppings have slightly increased. I pulled the new flametrap to see if something had already started to clog it, but it was still very clean. I still have not eliminated piston ring blow-by as a source for excessive crank pressure - if it's still there. I am thinking that if I was getting compression blow-by, then I would see evidence of carbon or some kind of build-up on the flametrap. Does anyone support or disagree with this thinking? Maybe I just need to replace leaking seals.
#24
07-15-2010, 03:17 PM
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#25
07-15-2010, 04:14 PM
Question for steve (typhoon)
Steve, thinning the oil with kerosene won't hurt the engine?
You are talking about a few thousand kilometers...
What country do you live in?
How safe is to drive my 93 volvo 940, non turbo, a few hundred miles
at freeway speed, 65-70 miles/hour with the kerosene in the oil?
Please let me know.
Thank you.
Hector
You are talking about a few thousand kilometers...
What country do you live in?
How safe is to drive my 93 volvo 940, non turbo, a few hundred miles
at freeway speed, 65-70 miles/hour with the kerosene in the oil?
Please let me know.
Thank you.
Hector
#26
07-15-2010, 04:22 PM
Question for steve (typhoon)
Steve, thinning the oil with kerosene won't hurt the engine?
You are talking about a few thousand kilometers...
What country do you live in?
How safe is to drive my 93 volvo 940, non turbo, a few hundred miles
at freeway speed, 65-70 miles/hour with the kerosene in the oil?
Please let me know.
Thank you.
Hector
You are talking about a few thousand kilometers...
What country do you live in?
How safe is to drive my 93 volvo 940, non turbo, a few hundred miles
at freeway speed, 65-70 miles/hour with the kerosene in the oil?
Please let me know.
Thank you.
Hector
#27
07-15-2010, 06:49 PM
Since I originated this post I thought I oughta give another update which I hope will be my final update regarding this particular problem. After replacing the entire flametrap system and still experiencing a small leak from the front crank seal, I added Seafoam to the motor oil, ran it for 100 miles, drained motor oil and replaced with new oil which included Seafoam. All oil leaking has ceased (knock on wood).
#28
07-15-2010, 07:26 PM
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Oil leakage Problem
I pulled off the flame trap and looked down into the oil separator box,..but I couldn't really get a good enough angle looking downward, to see what the inside looked like.
It looked dirty, that's for sure. I ordered one just now from IPD. Man, IPD sure is addicting.
Anyways, once I get it, what can I expect when replacing it as far as all the oil residue around the base of the Sep. box? Should I try to clean around it first...so when I remove it it won't get to much gunk where it shouldn't be?
And, there is oil in the air intake plastic piece, between the MAF and the TB. The separator box must be totally clogged.
On the other note, about the A/C Tension Bolt: I did install that today, and it went well. A/C blowing cold once again, and no belt squealing.
If I knew how to put pics on here, I took a couple of the angle of the PS Pulley, and the bolt I had to install, just for reference.
Thanks again for the guidance.
It looked dirty, that's for sure. I ordered one just now from IPD. Man, IPD sure is addicting.
Anyways, once I get it, what can I expect when replacing it as far as all the oil residue around the base of the Sep. box? Should I try to clean around it first...so when I remove it it won't get to much gunk where it shouldn't be?
And, there is oil in the air intake plastic piece, between the MAF and the TB. The separator box must be totally clogged.
On the other note, about the A/C Tension Bolt: I did install that today, and it went well. A/C blowing cold once again, and no belt squealing.
If I knew how to put pics on here, I took a couple of the angle of the PS Pulley, and the bolt I had to install, just for reference.
Thanks again for the guidance.
#29
07-16-2010, 11:54 PM
Banned
I pulled off the flame trap and looked down into the oil separator box,..but I couldn't really get a good enough angle looking downward, to see what the inside looked like.
It looked dirty, that's for sure. I ordered one just now from IPD. Man, IPD sure is addicting.
Anyways, once I get it, what can I expect when replacing it as far as all the oil residue around the base of the Sep. box? Should I try to clean around it first...so when I remove it it won't get to much gunk where it shouldn't be?
And, there is oil in the air intake plastic piece, between the MAF and the TB. The separator box must be totally clogged.
On the other note, about the A/C Tension Bolt: I did install that today, and it went well. A/C blowing cold once again, and no belt squealing.
If I knew how to put pics on here, I took a couple of the angle of the PS Pulley, and the bolt I had to install, just for reference.
Thanks again for the guidance.
It looked dirty, that's for sure. I ordered one just now from IPD. Man, IPD sure is addicting.
Anyways, once I get it, what can I expect when replacing it as far as all the oil residue around the base of the Sep. box? Should I try to clean around it first...so when I remove it it won't get to much gunk where it shouldn't be?
And, there is oil in the air intake plastic piece, between the MAF and the TB. The separator box must be totally clogged.
On the other note, about the A/C Tension Bolt: I did install that today, and it went well. A/C blowing cold once again, and no belt squealing.
If I knew how to put pics on here, I took a couple of the angle of the PS Pulley, and the bolt I had to install, just for reference.
Thanks again for the guidance.
no need to wipe anything really won't be able to very hard to get at...make sure you put new a seal on it too before you install. No cause bellows has what looks like oil does not mean oil seperator is clogged means you need to clean your throttle body and plate...
#30
07-19-2010, 09:12 AM
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I can not find a oil separator for my 740 GL 1989 B230F anywhere.. Am I looking in the wrong place? I checked IPD, FCP and vlvworld. I want a NEW one not a used one.
Please help.
[EDIT] I did another Google search and it linked me directly to it at IPD Weird I couldn't get to this point from their website..
Please help.
[EDIT] I did another Google search and it linked me directly to it at IPD Weird I couldn't get to this point from their website..
Last edited by Timbone1343; 07-19-2010 at 09:15 AM.
#31
07-19-2010, 12:42 PM
Banned
I can not find a oil separator for my 740 GL 1989 B230F anywhere.. Am I looking in the wrong place? I checked IPD, FCP and vlvworld. I want a NEW one not a used one.
Please help.
[EDIT] I did another Google search and it linked me directly to it at IPD Weird I couldn't get to this point from their website..
Please help.
[EDIT] I did another Google search and it linked me directly to it at IPD Weird I couldn't get to this point from their website..
#32
09-09-2010, 01:41 AM
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I can not find a oil separator for my 740 GL 1989 B230F anywhere.. Am I looking in the wrong place? I checked IPD, FCP and vlvworld. I want a NEW one not a used one.
Please help.
[EDIT] I did another Google search and it linked me directly to it at IPD Weird I couldn't get to this point from their website..
Please help.
[EDIT] I did another Google search and it linked me directly to it at IPD Weird I couldn't get to this point from their website..
http://www.partsgeek.com/catalog/198..._oil_trap.html
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