Hello Everyone. I'm new to this post, as I recently purchased a 1993 Volvo 850 about a month ago. The car has actually been doing pretty good so far, except that occasionally it stalls on us.

As I haven't had the finances to do any repairs, I haven't tested anything out yet, except for the charging system. Battery tested fine, and my Alternator tested at 12.65. After about the 3rd time it actually stalled on us, the battery was dead, as it stalled about 3 times in about 20 minutes. So that's when we had them tested. Charged battery to a full charge, hasn't had trouble starting since, so I don't believe the issue is with the alternator/battery. The car seems to stall only when the car is at least at regular running temperature. The last time this happened, we were on the freeway. The temperature gauge, which seems to work just fine, was not even close to being hot. All the sudden we just lose any gas at all. The motor still runs until we get closer to idleing rpms, and then it just dies. This has happened as well just letting the car sit and idle for about 15-20 minutes, and it just stalls. I checked the spark plugs, and they seem a little old, but not bad. I will be doing a little tune up in a week or so, spark plugs, wires, distributor cap/rotor. I'm thinking it may be something with the fuel pump/relay, as the motor seems to keep running until the rpms die down. I would really like to keep from spending $250 just for the fuel pump, so any ideas certainly would help, and would be greatly appreciated. BTW, the car is a non turbo. Thanks!



Tim

 

You say the Alt is only charging 12.65?
If so thats way to low.
Take your meter and check from the Alt and see what the output is.
You should be at like 13.25 or so.
You might have a bad battery terminal on the positive cable.

 

Thanks for the input I had the alternator checked at autozone, and they said it was only pushing 12.65, but not really sure they knew what they were doing with their tester lol. I know the positive terminal on the battery has some bare wire, I was planning on re-doing that as well. The car hasn't stalled in the last couple days though, even with the car being up to normal temperature. So the issue definitely seems to be random. Maybe something getting to hot, or something a little loose shorting out. I'm going to try to redo the battery terminal today and see what I can find out. Thanks for the help!


Tim

 

Hi there,

This is a common problem on the 850, but unfortunately there isn't just one thing which causes the problem. It could be any of the following listed in order of cheapest to most expensive:

Dirty MAF Sensor (Get some Electronic cleaner and spray the element - don't touch-$10)
Clogged Fuel Filter (Replace - Behind Rear passenger wheel - $12)
Badly Fouled Plugs (Replace - $15)
Bad Distributor Cap or rotor (Replace Both-$20)
Dying Fuel Pump Relay (Replace-$30)
Bad Oxygen sensor (Replace with universal and spice in wires - $25)
Bad Crank Position Sensor (Lower engine on flywheel - $45 )
Fuel Injection Relay (Replace -$60)
Fuel Pressure Regulator (Replace - $75)
Bad Throttle Position Sensor (At throttle body $80 )
Bad MAF Sensor (In tube coming out od airbox - $100 )
Bad Cam Position Sensor (Drivers side of engine attached to cam with wires coming out - $130 )
Bad Fuel Pump ( At tank $250 )


This is the order in which I'd do things (After checking codes of course, unfortunately the stalling issue does produce bad codes. since other systems get fouled up b whatever is making it stall and can cause "intermittent signal" codes to be returned) It's a pain in the **** chasing down the problem, but at least you know it's unlikely a mechanical problem since the motor usually runs just fine, and without any hiccups. But these electrical gremlins are frustraing sine they aren't as obvious. Hope this helps.....

 

Aussiesuede is right, a lot of things could cause it, but start with the easiest/cheapest/ most obvious causes first.

Glenn

 

Thanks for the info guys. It really helps me a lot on where I'm going to start. I've already done a small tune-up on the car. Changed spark plugs/oil/air filter. Didn't really seem to effect the car too much with the stalling issue, but kind of figured it wouldn't change anything. I checked the codes on the car today....The only code that it gave out was under the ignition, with a 3-1-1 code for the speed sensor signal faulty or absent. The funny thing is, when I purchased the vehicle, the speedometer didn't work. I took it into the shop where I purchased, and they ended up replacing the whole dash cluster. Speedometer seems to work fine, maybe the code was from earlier when the speedometer wasn't working? I purchased the fuel filter, and going to clean the MAF. I'll let you guys know what happens. Thanks again!



Tim

 

Check the proximity of the speed sensor wires to the coil wire or spark plug wires. In its natural state the speed sensor cable loops up near the ignition andthe sparktends to interfere with the signal VSS signal. There was a TSB on it a few years ago that calls for using a tye wrap to foldthe sensor wireup and keep it away from the distributor cap and the ignition wires.

...Lee

 

Chupa,

I forgot to add one thing to my list, and it should actually have been the first thing. When the temp sensor goes bad it doesn't react like most cars and just make the needle not move - it instead sends the needle to the center position (ie - normal) which is pretty stupid imo. So if your thermostat were bad and the sensor became damaged the first time it overheated, you'd never really know you were overheating. So definitely change the thermostat FIRST. Think about it, that little $5 part is important. If you're only stalling at what your believe to be operating temp, then there's an off chance it's as simple as a bad thermostat causing overheating - and the sensor telling the ecu to shut down. Since you're starting with the cheapest stuff first - go ahead an put in a thermostat. It's literally a 2 minute job on the 850. (2 T-40 torx bolts on the water neck just behind the steering pump - lift off, insert new thermo, reinstall 2 bolts. Might take 4 minutes your first time hehe)

 

And make sure to use the correct size Torx, as they can easily strip. There seem to be 2 OEM thermostats; Whaler (German) & Vernet (French). I used the Vernet for replacement but it looked rather flimsy compared to the original, but has no trouble as far as the function is concerned. The new thermo should come with a new seal ring. I used paste-type water pump sealant between the upper & lower housings, which is probably not a necessary step. Also, in case if the Torx screws are tight or the housings wouldn't separate easily, be careful not to use much impact, since those housings are made of aluminium and can easily break.

The speedo also fails if the ABS module has certain types of troubles, as the speedo receives electrical signal from the ABS module.

FYR:
https://volvoforums.com/m_48928/tm.htm

My 1st & 2nd replies cover basic servicing items.

Best of luck to you,


JPN

 

I will be sure to change the thermostat this weekend. I didn't really think about the temperature being an issue, as the needle was moving lol. I know when idleing or in bad traffic, the needle stays in "normal operating temperatures." But when we get going on the freeway, or at least fast enough for good air flow, the temperature guage drops considerably, sometimes on the freeway all the way down to the bottom of the gauge. The heater in the car works well, so I know the thermostat is not closed. I will give that a shot though, definitely a cheap fix, and worth it. I did also change out my positive battery terminal, and it's a lot more secure now, not sure if that would have been part of it or not, I know it was mentioned earlier in this post. I also purchased a fuel filter that I'm going to replace this weekend as well, as I purchased it before you posted the list Aussie. Thanks for the info guys, I really do appreciate it!!


Tim

 

Now that you fixed the positive cable I will bet you are charging about 13V or a little over.

 

I really appreciate the feedback I've been getting from you guys. Aussie, I'm pretty sure you're right with the thermostat idea. I've been keeping a close eye on when it stalls, and, come to find out, my cooling fan wasn't working. I've been watching the temperature gauge and it never goes above the middle (normal temperature), but the heater blows really hot air. I've got my cooling fan fixed now, so we'll see how it does with that going...I bought the thermostat and was going to replace it, but also found out, that one of the star bit bolts in the housing is completely, and I mean completely, stripped out. I'm not sure what I can do to get that bolt out, as the head is rounded like a screw, and there's nothing that will fit inside as now it's just a circle instead of a star bit lol. I've tried a couple different things, but nothing gets around the head of the bolt good enough to get it loose. I'm hoping my cooling fan keeps it going for now until I can figure something out about the thermostat. But yeah, keeping the heater going full blast all the time, and not being in stop and go traffic, it's been running just fine. But if the heaters off, and traffics bad or not moving fast, it dies on us. So thanks again for the info guys, you have no idea how much I appreciate it!


Tim

 

Hi Tim,

Glad to hear we've been some help for you.

>one of the star bit bolts in the housing is completely, and I mean completely, stripped out.
I hate it when that happens.

As to the stripped screws, at the moment I can only think of 2 options:

1. With a small chisel, hit the screw gently toward CCW to see if it moves. If it does move even a bit, then you can gradually work it out. The hard part is that you cannot exert much force or the aluminium housings will crack.

2. Grab the screw with a Vise-grip and try to turn it CCW.

Wait to see if others have more effective solutions.


JPN

 

Ok, so I haven't had a chance to get the thermostat replaced yet, as I'm still trying to think of a way to get that stripped bolt out of there without cracking the housing. In the meantime I've replaced the fuel filter, and the issue is still there. I'm going to be ordering the fuel pump relay, and my main question is where is it located? I took the cover off from where the fuses are, and found the relays in there, but nothing in the repair manual stated which relay is which. I'm also not sure where other relays may be, so any help on this would be greatly appreciated Also, when I checked the relays next to the fuses, I had a smaller Green relay in the middle, and when I was checking it and tried putting it back in, I noticed that the plug for it acted like it was attached to a spring. I could push the plug pretty much flush with the bottom of the area. When I checked the other relays, (by checking, i mean just checking the contacts) the plugs for the other relays didn't move at all. Is this a bad thing or is it normal behavior for that certain relay?


Tim

 

FYR.


JPN

[IMG]local://upfiles/6892/E6A7716F775D428EA030399B67C4385C.jpg[/IMG]

 

That clarify's exactly what I was looking for. Thank you! That's exactly the relay that I was talking about when it came to the "springy" plug that the relay connects to. Would you know if that's normal behavior for that relay, or is it broken? Thanks a bunch!

 

In general, the springy feel is normal for a relay as the electro-magnetism pulls a contact to make a closed circuit. But refer to Tech's suggestions as I myself have never had to deal with any of the relays in my 850.

Welcome a bunch,


JPN

 

Just a quick question. I ordered the fuel pump relay, and just received it yesterday. The relay that I was hoping to get, was the relay next to the fuse box. The relay I ended up getting, is the relay that sits up next to the fan relay. I see in other posts, that Tech mentions it being an injector relay. Is that the major relay that causes these issues, or do I need to order the other relay as well?.....I installed the new relay which sits above the fan, so I'll have to wait and see if it resolves anything or not. Thanks for the help!

 

The injector relay may be referred to as "Main Relay", as I've only found two replays on that cooling fan shroud; Main Relay & Fan Relay. There may be other relays there but I no longer have my 850 and am only going through the manual.

I don't know how often the injector relay fails, but the fuel pump relay is definitely known to fail at a high rate.


JPN

 

With the relays on the shroud, the only ones that I see are the fan relay, and the "main" relay or injector relay from the documents that I've seen. I replaced it the other day, and it still stalls, so I had to order the other relay which I was wanting in the first place, which is the relay next to the fuse box. I'm crossing my fingers that the relay will resolve the issue, but if it doesn't resolve it, what should be the next step to try?....i've cleaned the contacts on the MAF sensor as well, and still has the issue. Thanks for the info!


Tim