has anyone tried e3 plugs in an effort to improve the FE of their 850?

• E3 Spark Plugs

i've picked up a set to try - 100% money back guarantee so if they don't perform well i'll go back to OEM.

also, i just installed Bridgestone Ecopia EP422 tires which seem to be one of the most effective FE improving tires:

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B9M...0dpemFUcy1GdWc

Tire Test Results : Eco-Focused All-Season Tires: Do They Deliver on the Promise?

I personally do NOT recommend a K&N filter. The reason they flow better is because they don't filter as well. Many Used Oil Analysis tests have confirmed that increased oil contamination and engine wear result from the use of high-flow air filters.

i'm working on getting my new-to-me 850 to stage 0 and hoping to better the EPA MPG ratings significantly

 

We listed that earlier in the thread.

 

Grrrrr. My mileage dropped from 29 mpg (highway) to 24 (when I popped a P0422 code). I changed my spark plugs and o2 sensors. My trip last week I still only got 25 mpg. Is there something else I need to check or is it possible that all the weight I had in the wagon caused the drop? I had about 300 lbs in the back of the car.

 

My Turbo is a wagon and my T5 a sedan, both cars are at 196,000 miles. The wagon gets closer to 28 on the highway while my T5 usually right at 26. I can get 20 mpg in town with both myself, but not the wife. I do not stop at lights, I will slow down blocks ahead just to keep the car over 15 mph if possible. One other note we are in Nevada and I get 26 mpg with the cruise set a 80 mph! We have a lot of 75 mph highways here, you need it.

 

I'd like to add a pointer to this, but it's more about driving style as opposed to car mods to get better MPG. Now, my proof is more layman-friendly.. I never looked at any math or did real time calculations, but I can tell you from my 20 mile commute to work, I can usually get 1 or 2 more trips in on the same amount of money. I can spend 20 bucks and go 80 miles, or 100.

The way I get the best MPG is to AVOID grannying the gas pedal. If you accelerate too slow, then your car just spends more time working on building momentum. Find where you get the most push with the smallest effort, and use that power. Don't floor it, but make sure the car gets a good push where it's the easiest load on the motor. Mine occurs around the 28 - 3,500RPM range. This way, you get it up to speed, and you spend more time cruising, less time accelerating.

I tightened my WG rod as well to move the powerband of the turbo to the lower end. This SEEMS to benefit my MPG a small amount. Since doing it, I feel like I can get a few more miles off of a quarter tank. (I would do a fill test, but I have no odometer). Not sure on 'real numbers' results, but what I can say safely is when I throw 40 bucks in the tank, I could normally make about 8 20 mile trips with it, but now I can get 10 or sometimes 11 if I don't race it.

 

All,

I would like to improve my gas mileage.

I drive a 1997 855R. The odometer shows 105,xxx miles as of today, but the odometer is 10-20k shy of actual mileage based on my calculations. The odometer stopped, and the car sat parked for a few years where it was very rarely driven before I rescued it.

Since purchasing it, I've replaced timing belt, water pump, related tensionsers/hardware, serpentine belt, plugs and wires, PCV system and a few other bits here and there including an oil change. It is also on its original air filter, which looks clean on both sides and hasn't disintegrated. I plan on adding one to my next FCP order regardless and will replace it.

It is on its original oxygen sensors, rotor and cap.

I calculated the parts cost, and the O2 sensors, rotor and cap from FCP are around $350.

I keep my tires inflated to what the sticker on the gas door says.

I drive about 50/50 city and highway.

I am running 10w40 conventional oil presently. Have enough for 1 change left, and would consider synthetic at that point.

I try to keep my foot out of the gas. It's not always easy, but I'm not a lead foot, and I'm not launching it at every intersection.

I drive around 20k a year. I have averaged ~18 MPG since I replaced the odometer gears a little over 2k miles ago.

Gas is presently around $4 a gallon for premium where I live. It goes up and down a little, but for the purpose of calculation, I'm figuring $4 a gallon.

Doing some basic math, I came up with this...

At 18 MPG, my annual fuel cost is $4444.44
At 20 MPG, my annual fuel cost is $4000.00, a savings of $444.44 over present
At 22 MPG, my annual fuel cost is $3636.36, a savings of $808.08 over present

Granted, there's some room for error here, and it's not exact, but it's a close approximation.

I know Robert likes his Scan Gauge II, and those look pretty neat, and perhaps someday, I'll get one and play with it.

What are your thoughts and suggestions?

 

How long have you had it and how many miles have you put on it ??

The biggest difference is the "egg on the throttle". Like you said about keeping your foot out of the gas that is likely the biggest thing you can do. Even on a modified engine you can get pretty fair mileage if you don't use those modifications. The more you push your engine in RPMs and power demands the thirstier it get !!

For me, air filter 12-18K depending on how it looks. What you don't see sometimes is more important that what you do. Are you holding it up to a light to try and look through it or are you just popping the top and looking down at it ?? For the cost of an air filter, when in doubt replace. You can use a magic marker on the rubber rim (top side) so you know miles and date last replaced.
I do the same thing to fuel filters with touch up paint so I know when I put them in and when to pull them. No way to tell by just looking at the condition of the part.

Don't wait till it's this bad !! ( I know it's a cabin air filter)



Rspi asked about tire pressure in a different thread and I think most people looking for mileage are going a little over the recommended settings. If you're running stock tires you can safely go 4-5 pounds higher. Take a look at the sidewall as it will have a "Max" rating and it might surprise you how high it is.

Inspect the cap and rotor and if they look burnt on the working contacts or there is a lot of blackish material on them, replace.

Same with the plugs, inspect them or just replace and know you're good.
For the trouble of inspecting I'd just go with replacing.

Change over to synthetic. Even if you are using a "house brand" on sale it will give you better mileage but more importantly it's better for all the moving parts. From what I've seen in reports that "better mileage" is something you can barely measure so don't expect to "see" the difference.
The house brand suggestion is just for those that can't bring themselves to part with 9-15 bucks a quart for oil, like me. Or who just want to save a little when they can. I'm not pushing a particular brand just want to let you know it's out there. I asked a number of people about who makes theirs (Oreilly and Autozone) and the answer seems to be the name brand company that at that time gave the lowest bid. It's a good option to get synthetic at a good price and even better when it's on sale.



Not sure if this will help but it surely wouldn't hurt as it's used to calculate the fuel being injected.
Replace the front O2 sensor only. The rear sensor does not do anything to impact fuel usage.

There is room for error and improvement. Do you have any modifications ??
18 just sounds low. Do you have stock tires and have you taken it out on the freeway and checked your odometer against the freeways mile markers to see if something is off ??
Do you have the stock trip computer and are the numbers coming off it or are you actually doing the math ??

 

I've had the car about 3 months. I've put a little over 2000 miles on it since I fixed the odometer, and figure another 1500 miles before that - but the ones before I fixed the odo are not in my calculation, because I didn't keep track before then.

I don't want to run a K&N. Not a cost issue, more an issue that I've heard they can allow more crap past than they should, even when oiled properly. The only thing I see available locally are STP and Wix, both at $16. I see FCP has some better deals. Perhaps I should just pick up a STP or Wix locally and run it til the next change interval.

Plugs were new less than 5k ago. So, I am comfortable leaving them in the car. I had a mechanic friend do the plugs along with the timing belt and the water pump when I got the car.

I'll move to synthetic after I use up the 10 quarts of Valvoline 10w40 synthetic blend I have in house for my next oil change. I'm also being a little cheap on oil because I had a significant leak with the PCV system. I thought it was kicked in the head afterwards, but it's still leaking a bit. Need to get under the car and see if I can pinpoint where. Hoping it's not the RMS, because that's something I'd have to farm out instead of tackle myself. I would rather spend the $600 getting a new R front spoiler to replace my destroyed one than paying the mechanic to install a new RMS 5 quart jugs of Mobil 1 are $22.47 at my local Walmart - that's only about $1/quart more than the blend I'm running now. As far as Synthetics go, Mobil 1 is the one I've run before and have been perfectly happy using it, so why change?

Zero mods. Not even a tree air freshener

The tires are not the stock Pirelli P-Zeros, I run Toyo Proxes in the stock size, though. Inflated to the pressure on the gas door. I will probably look at some different tires next spring - I have a set of 16 inch wheels I plan on running in place of the Volans when the winter comes. The Proxes have enough tread to get through the rest of the season. Perhaps I'll look at something a little more fuel mileage friendly at the end of this season.

I have the trip calculator, but I am doing the math myself. I track the # of miles on the trip odo every time I fill up, as well as the number of gallons I put in. I keep it in a phone app and a spreadsheet. I have checked the odometer against the mile markers on the interstate in several places as well as against a local 5 mile 'odometer test' zone. It's dead on.

Is there any reason I should consider seafoming?

 

Seafoam is a whole different story.

It wouldn't hurt. When you look in through the oil fill do you see and sludge ?? Any foamy stuff on the bottom of the oil fill cap ??

If so, toss some in. I think it's an excellent cleaner for an engines insides. Does it increase mileage ???? no clue.

 

Went and got the Wix air filter tonight and installed it.

Took the 10 quarts of Valvoline Synth Blend 10w40 back and picked up 10 quarts of Mobil 1 10W30 Pure Synthetic for High Mileage engines. And, a can of seafoam.

My oil fill cap had all sorts of crud on it, but when I did the PCV, I cleaned the bottom side super well with brake cleaner, and put on a new gasket.

 

I think 18 is low. The owners manual and things claim the R's should get 19 / 26, so you are not far from that. I'm currently getting 22 around town here which is about 50/50, average speed is about 29 mph. You can check that on your trip, far left, like 8 o'clock. That will really tell.

I was running 10w-30 and was having a problem with smoking and using oil. I switched to 10w-40 (which I usually use through summer) and those 2 problems went away. I'm up to 7,500 on this oil change (per recomendation from Blackstone labs) and I've only gone through 1-1/2 quarts. I was going through a quart every 1,500 miles.

One thing you have to consider is that each thing you do to improve fuel efficency you may gain 0.5 mpg but 5 things will add up to 2.5 mpg, which is a 10% gain. As per your numbers above, that can save you $400+ per year. Have a couple of good 1.5 mpg gains and you're up to the target $808 per year.

Really consider switching to Volvo plugs and replacing the wires if they are dated '97. I seen a wagon today that had the original wires installed, 93/47 (year and week). Crazy!!! Use the normal plugs, those fancy plugs don't do as well as long.

 

I have believed for many years that switching over to synthetic from regular oil can be risky, I used to be a shop flunky at Mesa Autoworks in Mesa AZ that is where I recall being informed that changing over after 100K miles can cause main seal leaks (they specialize in Volvo service). Mesa Autoworks uses a synthetic blend in everything now, I would consider changing to that rather than going pure synthetic on old seals. I run pure synthetic in my 96 turbo wagon, but I switched after I changed out my main seals. I run regular Castrol GTX in my 97 T5. Honestly I did not notice any difference between synthetic and regular oil for gas mileage ( owned my wagon for two years before I switched over) I keep track of mileage. I do like changing the oil at 8 to 10 thousand instead of 4-5K. If you are getting over 18 mpg with mixed driving as described you are pretty close, I would suggest watching the lights as I described earlier, if you can keep the car over 15 mpg in city traffic and accelerate a bit over 2500 rpm up to speed I think you will get more out of city driving than synthetic oil. I also notice with my turbo that I get better mpg if I roll up the windows and use the A/C than the opposite. Like I posted, thoughtful driving habits and good maintenance reduce cost of operation. One more personal observation my T5 does not do as well as my low pressure turbo in city driving I can usually get 21-22 with the wagon when I will get almost 20 with the T5 doing the same routes.

 

"Synthetic oil pressure is higher and can cause your main seals to leak."

Where did that come from ?





Are you talking about crankcase pressure or actual engine oil pressure in the galley from the oil pump ??

 

I've never heard that about synthetic. I try to avoid oil discussions, as it seems there are a lot of 'experts', and most of the 'experts' don't agree.

I have heard that synthetic oils have more detergents in them, and can wash away build-ups of sludge that were already there, and then, lacking the buildups around seals, it can cause leaks.

I converted my 95 Supercoupe to Mobil 1 5w30 7 or 8 years ago at around 125k miles. It just started leaking last year. I switched it to Motorcraft Synthetic blend last year, because a lot of other Ford guys recommended the oil to me. My 95 Supercoupe is pretty much 'used up' at this point, and leaks pretty much every fluid in some amount, so I'm not surprised it now leaks a little oil.

I guess, if my car is gonna leak, I better fix the leaks. So, if after my switch, I get some leaks, I will address them.

 

I'm running 20W50 Mobil 1 and I'm still in my 60s. Stays in the garage a lot as the Volvo is the daily driver. I don't have to worry about cold starts as it never ventures out in the winter. It's like driving a two wheel snow plow with the tire it has.
'95, auto, fully optioned, 66K, 245/50Z16's, Spoiler, Cold air w/cone, BBK 75mm TB, 75mm MAF, 5% OD, Magnaflow resonator, E85 mix

Sorry to hijack, John and I are talkin'

The Volvo I run 10W40 syn all year and haven't had a problem in the MN winters yet. I do have a 48 series battery. It's a little stronger than the factory original 47. My stage 0 is always monitored and parts replaced as needed or suspect.

If you trust someone for their opinion that's the best but if not on oil , , , the place to go is "Bob is the oil guy . com"

 

My SC (again, sorry for the OT post) is about all used up. It's at around 200k and leaks pretty much every fluid. It has rust starting around the back window and the lower edge of the drivers door. The hood has some rock chips and one of the bumper covers has some scrapes. The interior is starting to come apart at the top of the back seat, and the drivers seat is coming apart at the bolster as well.

When I priced getting it repainted, not even considering the fact that it needs mechanical and interior work, it would've been cheaper to buy a nicer 95 and get the 2 options I wanted, but couldn't find, when I bought it over 10 years ago: a 5 speed and a sunroof.

I'm on my 3rd radiator, 3rd battery, 3rd set of tires.. I love the car, but with 3 kids, it's not real practical. I will probably get whatever I can out of it, and put it into my car maintenance fund. Last year, I did plugs/wires/motor mounts/water pump/ps pump/idler pulleys/all 3 belts/hoses. Wish I could say I had the sense to do it all at once, as you know, that dang intercooler piping has to come off to do most anything to these cars.

I did score last week on eBay, a set of original factory service manuals for $4.99!

Back to the Volvo topic.. I drove my 850 to the pull a part yesterday. The only thing I changed was the air filter. It was about a 200 mile round trip. I can't give an accurate mileage diagnosis because I let the car idle for about an hour while I was in the pull a part, as my wife and kids were waiting in the car. It had the AC running the entire time. I got 17 MPG for the trip, but it sat and idled for an hour with the AC running, plus we got caught in bumper to bumper traffic on the interstate for 5 miles, crawling, because of construction. But, when I got there, I looked at the dash 'average' thingie, with the **** cranked all the way to the left on the info center, and it had been sitting at 22 for some time, and said 24 yesterday. Tough to know, I filled it back up and reset everything and see what I get going forward. I hope I see an improvement. Maybe can work the oil change in with the Mobil 1 this week, want to do the seafoam, first.

 

Plus 14.00 shipping !!




I wanted those
I have a set (different color) but I can't find them and I was going to buy those but forgot to be at the computer when they ended.

When you get ready to retire your Bird let me know what you're asking. If it's that worn out it might be a good parts car for me

Drop the seafoam in as soon as you can so it has time to clean while you are driving.

 

I picked up an OEM Bosch 15097 O2 sensor new in package for $50 earlier today on eBay. The seller was a little misleading in their auction, but I asked specific questions, they confirmed that it is an OEM Bosch in original packaging, and if what I get isn't what they promised, I'll file a claim and return it.

When seafoaming, do you do the 1/3rd in the gas tank, 1/3rd in the crankcase, and 1/3rd in a vacuum line?

How long should I drive with it before I drain the oil?

 

IMHO Seafoam doesn't do anything really well. Again, that was IMHO. It does however do a lot of things pretty good.

Anything you can add to your oil and your gas isn't going to do the best at either. Again it's just my opinion.
I do use it for engine cleaning and intake cleaning.

For engine cleaning and I think that's what Seafoam does best you can toss a whole can in each oil change and leave it in there till the next oil change. The longer it's in there the more "work" it will do cleaning.
I use a quart of trans fluid to do this as it has more detergeants than engine oil. But that's just me. 5 qts 10W40 and one Mercon V.

DO NOT confuse that with dedicated ENGINE FLUSH. Some of those are only recommended for 5-10 minutes at idle and to dump the oil, not to drive on at all.

The other thing it does well is for cleaning your throttle body, intake, combustion chamber and valves you want to suck it slowly through a small vacuum line upstream of the throttle body. Again it's best to use a whole can to do it and expect to have some white smoke billowing out the tailpipe while you're doing it.
There are a couple of seafoam products but from your 1/3-1/3-1/3 I know you're talking about the common can of liquid.
There is a pressurized can of cleaner with a special "straw" made just to do this intake cleaning. See photo below.

As a fuel injector cleaner I think it's a waste of time and my favorite is Lucas and my second choice is Chevron with techron. These two always seem to come out on top in discussions of fuel injector cleaners. NOT IMHO, it's what I've seen in discussions and in arguments I've had with other parts guys.

If you buy the Lucas take a look at buying the Quart. It's a little more than double the price of the single use bottle and it's good for about 5 treatments. I buy it by the gallon and it's cheaper yet.

 

Good info, thanks.

I'm pro lucas-anything, Spencer Lucas has done a lot of great things for my state. I'll check it out.