Front droning noise...coming from angle gear?
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Front droning noise...coming from angle gear?
I changed my oil yesterday. The car was spotless, from the top in the engine and inside out of the rest of the car. When I pulled the plastic cover to look at the pan/motor and access the filter and drain plug, I noticed that the cover had tons of crap on the inside of it. ATF, oil, and the front diff/angle gear/bevel gear housing is COVERED in black oil. Not ATF. Like, it was soaked in it. I can post pics later as I was way to dirty to hold a phone at the time. To be clear the oil pan/filter plug/motor were all spotless. Front diff, filthy.
I know that the transmission was replaced with a rebuilt, so that could explain the dirt debris oil/ATF on the INSIDE of the access/cover, but the oil on the front housing is very concerning.
The big issue is a droning noise that got a lot louder when I drove the car with the cover off. I noticed that it cuts out when the steering wheel is turned to the right as I travel, more so down hill, it seems like some kind of pressure is being taken off of something, maybe it's a wheel bearing, but there's no vibration shaking, no transmission lag, etc. Just the drone I'd previously taken as the normal operating sound of the front wheel drive.
I want/need to diagnose this correctly, my first guess instinct is something wrong with the angle gear, and I'm going to pull the plug on the housing today since I've got all the tools, pump out the oil, check it, and replace with Mobil 1 75w/90 gear oil.
Then go from there... I was down at FCP yesterday and spoke to the guys there, they say it's a common failure with this car and there's a rebuild kit they offer for @$370.00 with seals, bolts, parts, oil, etc. And that the noise is NOT normal for this.
What do you think? Which way should I go with this? The noise is constant and goes up with the speed of the vehicle, it doesn't change with shifting, just the speed of the wheels, getting higher pitched as higher speeds.
Thanks...
I know that the transmission was replaced with a rebuilt, so that could explain the dirt debris oil/ATF on the INSIDE of the access/cover, but the oil on the front housing is very concerning.
The big issue is a droning noise that got a lot louder when I drove the car with the cover off. I noticed that it cuts out when the steering wheel is turned to the right as I travel, more so down hill, it seems like some kind of pressure is being taken off of something, maybe it's a wheel bearing, but there's no vibration shaking, no transmission lag, etc. Just the drone I'd previously taken as the normal operating sound of the front wheel drive.
I want/need to diagnose this correctly, my first guess instinct is something wrong with the angle gear, and I'm going to pull the plug on the housing today since I've got all the tools, pump out the oil, check it, and replace with Mobil 1 75w/90 gear oil.
Then go from there... I was down at FCP yesterday and spoke to the guys there, they say it's a common failure with this car and there's a rebuild kit they offer for @$370.00 with seals, bolts, parts, oil, etc. And that the noise is NOT normal for this.
What do you think? Which way should I go with this? The noise is constant and goes up with the speed of the vehicle, it doesn't change with shifting, just the speed of the wheels, getting higher pitched as higher speeds.
Thanks...
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The angle gear is common to leak. I've rebuilt many. Its much less common to make noise though. What I would do is drive the vehicle on a lift and listen to the angle gear. But I also have access to a lift. From your description, I'd bet on a wheel bearing though.
Last edited by ES6T; Sep 16, 2015 at 09:14 AM.
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I've been googling and I came across links I can post to a lot of reference to both the turbo and PCV system being RIGHT above the angle gear housing, and also that the seals go often-I found this...but yesterday I REALLY paid attention after the change/visual inspection and definitely made me wonder about the noise cutting out when I turn right, sharper the turn, more noise reduction-that doesn't sound like something that would have any affect on the angle gear, so maybe I'm just freaking out expecting the worst.
I'm still going to at least pump out the oil and refill/inspect the old oil, warning on the ins and out are also below... Thanks, I'll repost when I get it figured out.
On the XC70 AWD system, angle gear is basically the converts the horizontal drive shaft coming out of the transmission to the drive shaft going to the rear of the car. Its a 90 degree angle turn. Therefore, I guess they named it "angle gear".
Seems the seal facing the passenger side leaks quite often. The Volvo tech in the following link claims to have never seen one that didn't leak. If your car is still under warranty, ask them to check it on the next service.
https://volvoforums.com/m_105354/tm.htm
Its important to keep appropriate fluid levels in the angle gear. Given the frequent seal leak (but probably minor in most cases) here and having only 700mL of fluid in here, you might want to check the level during every oil change. To check the level, you can use any straight piece of tool (I used a straightened metal paper clip, a screw driver would probably work) and inserted in the oil filler hole at a downward angle to see if you get oil on the tip of the tool.
Common Misdiagnose
The turbo sits right above the angle gear and this turbo is well known of leaking where it joins with the air intake hose (PVC system dump some crankcase vapor into the intake and the oil vapor pools into oil puddles and leaks at this joint) This in turn drips right onto the angle gear. The following link suggest you might smell the fluid as angle gear fluid has a distinctive smell.
Bevel Gear
The turbo oil return line that goes into the oil pan is another common leak location and also sits just above the angle gear. So make sure you diagnose it properly.
In my V70XC, it is the common turbo leak that drops oil onto the angle gear. The angle gear has a tiny leak. In fact, I can not detect any noticeable fluid level changes 30k+ miles after I changed its fluid.
Here are the directions to change this fluid
http://www.volvoxc.com/resources/how...eplacement.pdf
Caution: Note this direction calls for "Transmission Oil" in the parts list on the first page. This is NOT the ATF or Automatic Transmission Fluid. It is a much thicker gear oil than ATF. Proper substitutes are synthetic 75W-90 gear oils. The reason it is named "Transmission Oil" is because that is what Volvo prints on the bottle.
WARNING: DIYers changing oil often is a bit **** about getting ALL the old oil out. Since there are sharp metal edges in the gears inside the Angle Gear, the soft plastic tubing you insert inside can easily be cut. This requires disassembly to remove and turns a simple job into a much more expensive one. So just be happy you got most of it out and don't push/thread the tube inside too far. Here is an example of what can happen if you push your luck too far
Seems the seal facing the passenger side leaks quite often. The Volvo tech in the following link claims to have never seen one that didn't leak. If your car is still under warranty, ask them to check it on the next service.
https://volvoforums.com/m_105354/tm.htm
Its important to keep appropriate fluid levels in the angle gear. Given the frequent seal leak (but probably minor in most cases) here and having only 700mL of fluid in here, you might want to check the level during every oil change. To check the level, you can use any straight piece of tool (I used a straightened metal paper clip, a screw driver would probably work) and inserted in the oil filler hole at a downward angle to see if you get oil on the tip of the tool.
Common Misdiagnose
The turbo sits right above the angle gear and this turbo is well known of leaking where it joins with the air intake hose (PVC system dump some crankcase vapor into the intake and the oil vapor pools into oil puddles and leaks at this joint) This in turn drips right onto the angle gear. The following link suggest you might smell the fluid as angle gear fluid has a distinctive smell.
Bevel Gear
The turbo oil return line that goes into the oil pan is another common leak location and also sits just above the angle gear. So make sure you diagnose it properly.
In my V70XC, it is the common turbo leak that drops oil onto the angle gear. The angle gear has a tiny leak. In fact, I can not detect any noticeable fluid level changes 30k+ miles after I changed its fluid.
Here are the directions to change this fluid
http://www.volvoxc.com/resources/how...eplacement.pdf
Caution: Note this direction calls for "Transmission Oil" in the parts list on the first page. This is NOT the ATF or Automatic Transmission Fluid. It is a much thicker gear oil than ATF. Proper substitutes are synthetic 75W-90 gear oils. The reason it is named "Transmission Oil" is because that is what Volvo prints on the bottle.
WARNING: DIYers changing oil often is a bit **** about getting ALL the old oil out. Since there are sharp metal edges in the gears inside the Angle Gear, the soft plastic tubing you insert inside can easily be cut. This requires disassembly to remove and turns a simple job into a much more expensive one. So just be happy you got most of it out and don't push/thread the tube inside too far. Here is an example of what can happen if you push your luck too far
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I hope so... I DID jack up both wheels separately yesterday, I didn't have much time and I've blown out one knee pretty bad, both wheels had no back and forth play when I grabbed them and pulled them towards my chest and pushed back towards the car.
It seemed like the right wheel had more play when I rotated it back and forth though, the sound seems to cut out when I turn to the right than the left did. You can really hear it cut out when I'm going downhill and turn sharp right.
I've read conflicting reports on "If you turn this way(right or left), this wheel bearing is bad(right or left)"
With the windows open at speed, driving next to a small hill or jersey barrier, I can hear the sound bounce back at me, and I'd guess it's the right wheel that's louder. There's a place I can go today and really pay attention to it. Yesterday I tried to take it to a large local parking lot and pull circles, etc. but I didn't have enough room to get it up to speed and hear the noise.
Both IPD and FCP have an aftermarket hub for about $129.00, and Advance has a MOOG bearing with a $50.00 off coupon this week, about the same price. I looked at FCP's youtube video tutorial, this is totally something I can do, I just need to make sure I replace the correct bearing/hub assembly.
EDIT: Then there's ebay... damn cheap, but I'm not sure who the manufacturers are. I can get a set for the same price, or one for anywhere of about $40-$80... Not so sure about them though, some have a 1 year warranty.
Last edited by drenman; Sep 17, 2015 at 07:19 AM.
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I've replaced many bearings for noise and don't think I've seen more than one or two actually have play.
When you turn to the right, the weight of the car shifts to the left and vice versa. So if the noise increases when turning right, the left bearing is bad. If the noise decreases when turning to the right, the right bearing is bad.
I don't think I'd go with a super cheap one. You get what you pay for.
When you turn to the right, the weight of the car shifts to the left and vice versa. So if the noise increases when turning right, the left bearing is bad. If the noise decreases when turning to the right, the right bearing is bad.
I don't think I'd go with a super cheap one. You get what you pay for.
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I've replaced many bearings for noise and don't think I've seen more than one or two actually have play.
When you turn to the right, the weight of the car shifts to the left and vice versa. So if the noise increases when turning right, the left bearing is bad. If the noise decreases when turning to the right, the right bearing is bad.
I don't think I'd go with a super cheap one. You get what you pay for.
When you turn to the right, the weight of the car shifts to the left and vice versa. So if the noise increases when turning right, the left bearing is bad. If the noise decreases when turning to the right, the right bearing is bad.
I don't think I'd go with a super cheap one. You get what you pay for.
FCP takes care of me, both they and IPD said their aftermarket option is a safe and sound alternative vs. the Volvo OEM for almost twice as much.
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So, I don't know why I got it in my head it's the front wheel, I thin it might actually be the rear. My only highly dubious an un-scientific test is to drive next to a concrete barrier with the sound bouncing back at me, and listen. It get's a lot louder with the rear right passenger window down...
Any surefire way of detecting it without putting it on a lift or jack stands and actually listening to the bearing with a stethascope?
Thanks man.
Any surefire way of detecting it without putting it on a lift or jack stands and actually listening to the bearing with a stethascope?
Thanks man.
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