Volvo 960 fumes

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Old Oct 21, 2011 | 06:54 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by volvoofsocal
The Volvo specialist replaced the intake gasket and cleaned the PCV system, but that did not cure the fumes.
During the repair he noticed that the power steering fluid is leaking and he said this may be the reason for the fumes as the power steering is buring on the engine and causing the fumes to come in inside the cabin. Could that be possible? Your thoughts please.
Depends where the power steering is leaking from. If it leaking at the pump, it can actually burn up the alternator or even the AC compressor (which are under). If it leaks at the end of the rack, that does not get into the engine.
 
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Old Oct 22, 2011 | 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Henry10
Depends where the power steering is leaking from. If it leaking at the pump, it can actually burn up the alternator or even the AC compressor (which are under). If it leaks at the end of the rack, that does not get into the engine.

We checked our Volvo again today at a different mechanic and found out that the power steering leak is on the passenger side and it is not dripping on hot surface, so that's not be the reason for the fumes.

The mechanic asked a mufler shop to inspect the car and it was determined that there is no leak anywhere from the headers to the tailpipe however, both the mechanic and the mufler shop are suspecting that the catalytic converter may be bad. They suggested replacing it.
I was wondering which after market catalytic converter brand I need to get as far as I know the Volvo is very expensive. Please advise. Thanks.
 

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Old Oct 23, 2011 | 10:52 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by volvoofsocal
We checked our Volvo again today at a different mechanic and found out that the power steering leak is on the passenger side and it is not dripping on hot surface, so that's not be the reason for the fumes.

The mechanic asked a mufler shop to inspect the car and it was determined that there is no leak anywhere from the headers to the tailpipe however, both the mechanic and the mufler shop are suspecting that the catalytic converter may be bad. They suggested replacing it.
I was wondering which after market catalytic converter brand I need to get as far as I know the Volvo is very expensive. Please advise. Thanks.
There are tests that you can run to determine if Cat needs to be replaced. "Suspicion" is not adequate. Especially for a California Cat, which is expensive.
 
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Old Oct 24, 2011 | 01:22 PM
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Default cat converter

I don't know what the rules are in other states, but in IL the car is exempt from EPA test after 15 yrs. and I read about one owner removing their cat. convert altogether. Improved mpg. Maybe it's an option.
I don't like the fumes in my car either, haven't solved it yet. Going to look into the 'SAS delete' solution - the check valve may leak exhaust backwards. New valve is $40 but the system is extraneous anyway.
 
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Old Oct 24, 2011 | 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted by 850James23
I don't like the fumes in my car either, haven't solved it yet. Going to look into the 'SAS delete' solution - the check valve may leak exhaust backwards. New valve is $40 but the system is extraneous anyway.
I don't recommend SAS Delete if you have Emissions Inspection in your state. I don't think the work-around is reliable enough. Some people report EVAP DTCs afterwards, which will keep your CEL on.

Replacing the valve is very easy and trouble-free. I actually cleaned mine (Throttle Body Cleaner). It is really a very simple on-off device, operated by vacuum. Sometimes its door is stuck. Lubricate it and you're good to go. Worst-case, get a new one from the JY. Simple test is -- apply vacuum -- you should be able to blow thru.

PAIR (SAS System) is not extraneous -- it is part of the Emissions/Motronic system. ECU is calibrated with it.
 
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Old Oct 27, 2011 | 01:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Henry10
There are tests that you can run to determine if Cat needs to be replaced. "Suspicion" is not adequate. Especially for a California Cat, which is expensive.

I'm taking it to a different muffler shop this weekend for inspection. They told me that the cat may be clogged and causes leaks when the car is driven. These leaks are not noticeable at idle only when the car is driven.
 
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Old Oct 29, 2011 | 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by volvoofsocal
I'm taking it to a different muffler shop this weekend for inspection. They told me that the cat may be clogged and causes leaks when the car is driven. These leaks are not noticeable at idle only when the car is driven.
Any competent mechanic can diagnose with almost certainty if the Cat is bad. Like I said, there are tests and symptoms for it.

Someone has to check and give you a definitive answer.

"Cat Leaks only when the car is driven"?? With the car up on the lift, the mechanic can revv up the RPMs and actually see with their own eyes if fumes come out of the Cat. It's not that complicated.
 

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Old Oct 29, 2011 | 08:26 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Henry10
Any competent mechanic can diagnose with almost certainty if the Cat is bad. Like I said, there are tests and symptoms for it.

Someone has to check and give you a definitive answer.

"Cat Leaks only when the car is driven"?? With the car up on the lift, the mechanic can revv up the RPMs and actually see with their own eyes if fumes come out of the Cat. It's not that complicated.
You're absolutely right. It's all bunch of b.s.
You're not going to beleive this. I found the leak, it is coming from the exhaust pipes when it connect to the engine exhaust system. I kept starting cold and sniffing around. Today I started it cold again and went down next to the passenger side door right behind the wheel and I smelled contaminated fumes. Then I smelled the fumes from the tail pipe and it is a totally different smell. What I smell inside the car is the contaminated fumes by the passenger side door.
Please let me know your thougths on this and what's involved to repair it and how much do you think it'll cost.
Thank you very much for your help.
 
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Old Oct 29, 2011 | 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by volvoofsocal
You're absolutely right. It's all bunch of b.s.
You're not going to beleive this. I found the leak, it is coming from the exhaust pipes when it connect to the engine exhaust system. I kept starting cold and sniffing around. Today I started it cold again and went down next to the passenger side door right behind the wheel and I smelled contaminated fumes. Then I smelled the fumes from the tail pipe and it is a totally different smell. What I smell inside the car is the contaminated fumes by the passenger side door.
Please let me know your thougths on this and what's involved to repair it and how much do you think it'll cost.
Thank you very much for your help.
Lisa: I am afraid this is not specific enough. This Manifold could be leaking, or these pipes or the Cat.

When exhaust leaks -- you see it with a light, you hear it, and you feel the pressure with your hand.

About the repair: this will depend where the leak is.
 
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Old Oct 29, 2011 | 11:16 PM
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On my old 740, the manifold bolts use to come loose and sometimes fall off. Make sure whatever bolts you have there are tight.
 
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 12:01 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by Henry10
Lisa: I am afraid this is not specific enough. This Manifold could be leaking, or these pipes or the Cat.

When exhaust leaks -- you see it with a light, you hear it, and you feel the pressure with your hand.

About the repair: this will depend where the leak is.
Beleive me, I'm positive that the fumes are coming from this area between the passenger door and the wheel. Either the manifold or the pipes, not the cat. I've been inspecting and watching the car in different situations for weeks and today I noticed where the fumes are coming from.
I've shown the car to at least 3 muffler shops and three different mechanics and none of them was able to find where the leak is coming from. I'm going to take it to the local Volvo dealer. The Volvo shop that worked on the car ripped me off, they worked on the intake manifold eventhough there was no leak coming from there. They did at least two different tests to check the exhaust system and no findings. They completely failed to find the exhaust leak and they told me that they exhausted all hopes to find the leak. Almost telling me to sell the car. I really love this car and I think it'll be worth it to fix it at the Volvo dealer. I'm just going to get a quote first and let you know what they say.
 

Last edited by volvoofsocal; Oct 30, 2011 at 12:05 AM.
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 12:07 AM
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Originally Posted by rspi
On my old 740, the manifold bolts use to come loose and sometimes fall off. Make sure whatever bolts you have there are tight.
I hope it's the manifold bolts. That would be great.

Thanks.
 
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 07:44 AM
  #33  
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If 3 muffler shops did not find the leak, it is safe to say that there is no leak from the exhaust.

Besides heard and smelled, exhaust leaks can actually be seen, especially when the car is cold. Anyone can see white smoke.

Why do you say the mechanic that did the intake rip you off? I thought he replaced the PCV, etc., no?
 
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Henry10
If 3 muffler shops did not find the leak, it is safe to say that there is no leak from the exhaust.

Besides heard and smelled, exhaust leaks can actually be seen, especially when the car is cold. Anyone can see white smoke.

Why do you say the mechanic that did the intake rip you off? I thought he replaced the PCV, etc., no?
The muffler shops looked at the car when the it was hot in open environment. I couldn’t figure it out myself until I tried to sniff around several times when the car was cold, inside my garage in a more controlled environment. It was not easy to pinpoint. I realized that closing the passenger side windows made me less tired when driving and that coincides with my finding that the fumes come from the exhaust. I drive the car for over an hour every day, long enough for the fumes to make me sick.

The Volvo mechanic had the car several times over night but failed to find the leak. He assured me that the leak was due to the intake manifold gasket leaking. I went along with hopes that this will cure the fumes. He charged me $1,200 for replacing the intake gasket, servicing the PCV valve and testing the exhaust system and he was not able to find the source of the fumes.
 
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by volvoofsocal
The Volvo mechanic had the car several times over night but failed to find the leak. He assured me that the leak was due to the intake manifold gasket leaking. I went along with hopes that this will cure the fumes. He charged me $1,200 for replacing the intake gasket, servicing the PCV valve and testing the exhaust system and he was not able to find the source of the fumes.
I remember now; that's way too much. These cars are inexpensive and not hard to service DIY, if you can. If you have to go to a shop for everything they do get very expensive. Any 16 years-old car would...
 
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 06:05 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Henry10
I remember now; that's way too much. These cars are inexpensive and not hard to service DIY, if you can. If you have to go to a shop for everything they do get very expensive. Any 16 years-old car would...
Your are right, I think this car may not be for us. It's a good car but I think it was neglected by the previous owner.
We'll see what the dealer says and we'll go from there. Thanks.
 
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Old Oct 30, 2011 | 07:01 PM
  #37  
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As Henry said, any 16 year old car will have issues that need to be repaired, sooner or sooner. A 960 will be a better bet unless you run to a repair shop every time you suspect something is wrong.

An exhaust leak should be easy to find. There is a lot of pressure in the exhaust system. I always thought exhaust was colorless and odorless. Maybe that's just carbon monoxide. Maybe something else in the car is making you sick. Let the stealer look at the suspect leak you have found and hopefully that will be it.

My nephew purchased a 2001 Malibu and he has spent more than $2,000 on the car with less than 1,000 miles. Older cars cost money to keep on the road if you can't do repairs yourself.
 
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Old Oct 31, 2011 | 01:41 AM
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Originally Posted by rspi
As Henry said, any 16 year old car will have issues that need to be repaired, sooner or sooner. A 960 will be a better bet unless you run to a repair shop every time you suspect something is wrong.

An exhaust leak should be easy to find. There is a lot of pressure in the exhaust system. I always thought exhaust was colorless and odorless. Maybe that's just carbon monoxide. Maybe something else in the car is making you sick. Let the stealer look at the suspect leak you have found and hopefully that will be it.

My nephew purchased a 2001 Malibu and he has spent more than $2,000 on the car with less than 1,000 miles. Older cars cost money to keep on the road if you can't do repairs yourself.
True old cars will cost money to maintain, but I think it is worth it as you don't have car payments especially if it is a good car. I know the 960 is worth the money, but if I can't drive it or get sick every time I drive it, that's not worth it. If they fix this leak, I'll definitly keep it.
Believe me the exhaust leak was not easy to find, somehow, either the mechanics or muffler shops didn't look hard enough or they are just not familiar with the car or they were looking at it when the car was hot in the open. The way I find the fumes, is by sniffing around every time I start the car. This time I happened to do that early morning when the car was cold still in the garage, right after I started the engine. I got out of the driver side sniffed the tail pipe fumes which didn't smell like the fumes I smell inside, then I walked around to the passenger side and that was it. I went down on my knees and sniffed behind the wheel and that was the same smell that has been making me sick inside the car. It is making me sick because it is before the cat. The fumes after the cat from the tailpipe are less contaminated not as bad as the fumes inside the car coming from the exhaust before the cat. So in essence like you said the cat is fine. Anyway, I'll see what the stealer say and I'll let you know the outcome.
Thank you.
 

Last edited by rspi; Oct 31, 2011 at 08:23 AM. Reason: typo
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Old Nov 18, 2011 | 06:39 PM
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I took the car to another shop that knows Volvo cars especially older ones. The service manager/adviser pulled the car in and raised up in the air then went through the car with his flashlight from bumper to bumper. He brought up a lot of things that I was not aware of about the bad brake job that was done and the short cut transmission service (black fluid in transmission) that was done couple of month ago, and the loose shifter that should have been fixed by all other shops that looked at the car.
Regarding the fumes, he had hard time finding it then he noticed that there is a pipe that comes out of the exhaust manifold towards the intake manifold by the fire wall and he noticed that there is white coloration traces that he believes is due to the exhaust fumes leaking from that pipe where it connects to the exhaust manifold. He was straight forward by saying that's the only area I suspect the leak could be coming from but I can't guarantee it, I think it's a 50/50 chance that it could be it but it is worth trying it. I think this is the last resource, so, I'll go for it, if not, the car is up for sale. I’ll let you know the outcome. Thank you all for your help. I really appreciate your support and your knowledge.
 
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