Dear All,

It's been a while since I posted a threat, I mean ([8D]), a thread last time. I remember, it was about how to remove the clamp bolts on front suspensions' lower control arm ball joints, which were frozen to the knuckle. With Tech's advice, a portable propane torch, a chisel + hammer violence andplenty of swearing, that bolts finally gave in. I then had to fight more against the ball joint whose stud was stuck in the clamping portion of the knuckle. But after replacing the ball joints (luckily, the car had replaceable ball joints), as well as many metals in the front suspension & 4-wheel alignment, the handling had improved noticeably. I think that was the only time that "Macho" attitude worked. Well, enough burble for my good old days in Chicago.

Anyway, I've been searching for this problem for a while, but still haven't been able to find where the water is entering from. After it rains, there is a puddle of water on the bottom of the spare tyre well. This car is actuallymy friend's (Yes, it's yours John).

After some research, I came up with the following possibilities:

1. The thin roof mouldings that extend to the top sides of the rear window. If the moulding gets loose, it may allow entry of water through the "C" pillar internally, and there may be a secret passage for water, leading directly into the spare tyre well thatonly a certain people inside Volvo know about....

2.Gaps or cracks around the brake light lens mountings.

3. Rear spoiler mounts, if so installed.

4. Someone you know has a spare key for the trunk and trying toshare his moments withyou[8D].


To detect the leak, I came up with the following procedures:

1. Remove all the interior trim pieces from the trunk and shove someone you know in there (no children, please), giving him/her a flashlight and you dump a bucket full of water for him/her with the lid closed, of course. A nice surprise. You could also add some paint-safe tracer dye, and give your assistant a blacklight.

2. Remove all the interior trim pieces from the trunk and wax the heck out of thetrunk compartment to see if beads of water appear along the leak.

3. Dump a bucket full of extra-sweet liquid, the one that attracts ants most effectively and follow them....sorry if this happens to attract your annoying neighbor's annoying kids instead of noble ants. What an annoyance[8D]. If your nerves are about to break down with them, you always have the choice of dumping a bucket full of 100% concentration of coolant by accident of course, and if the annoying kids happen to drink.....oh no.....I thought it was a new kind of melon juice.........it was an accident.....(note that I'm seriously kidding, never leave coolant within kids' & pets' reach).

4. Mix plenty of dish-washing liquid or laundry detergent, the one that creates more bubbles than you need, and follow the bubbles.....capilary reaction that is, come on......

5. Dump a bucket full of coffee with more sugar than you would consume in your entire life, and see if it leaves sugar residue.....Why coffee? Well, while you're at the challenge, the aroma will give you some pleasure during the boring period of waiting for the liquid portion to evaporate.

6. Drill a drain hole on the bottom of the well.

Sorry guys, I should know when to shut up. But if you've had the same experience and found a solution, I highly honor your courage to step forward.


JPN

 

If I remember right, there is a drainhole where the trunk meets the body. That could possibly be clogged.....

 

Thanks for the suggestion, Jimmy. At the moment I cannot tell, as I'm Volvoless (or even tricycleless). Wasthe drain holeon your wagon, or was it on sedans as well?

I've researched about 30 websites in Japan, and leaky trunks don't seem uncommon, but most of the time it's either the weather strip, tail lamp lens, sunroof drain clogged or the hose disconnected, etc... I am out of ideas right now as to where the leak is coming from.

It's starting to get a bit humid & warm here in Japan. I hope summer in MN is mild. I can take cold weather, but the heat & humidity disable me.


JPN

 

LOL ...

Kanji you have a very creative mind...

I especially liked the one concerning the ants, of course excluding
the part concerning children and pets. That got me to thinking,
maybe I could soak some hamburger in a pail of water, remove
the hamburger and pour the water over the closed trunk. Then
I could borrow my neighbor's dog and turn it loose in the trunk
and let it find the leak.
...hmm, that reminds me of something that a friend did a couple
of years ago. He had a dog that had been in the family for a few
years. He lives in a wooded area and the dog suddenly took off
into the woods one night, probably chasing deer. His dog didn't
return and after a week they put up posters etc. in hopes of
someone returning the dog. The following week they saw the
dog crossing the street a couple of blocks from his house.
He said he remembered that dogs mark their territories with
urine. So late that night he went to the front of his property and
...ummm...lets just say he personally marked it ....

The next day the dog was at his front door and hasn't left since.
Sorry I know this has nothing to do with volvos...

RedTurbo850,thanks for your suggestion, I will check the drains.

Best regards, John

 

Pretty funny, but I can not stand the smell of coffee so that one's out.

 

>Pretty funny, but I can not stand the smell of coffee so that one's out.
Jim, may I offer English tea or Green tea instead? Or, 50:50 mixture of milk & sugar could perhaps do the trick?


JPN

 

Hi JimKW and Kanji,

I do like the smell of coffee but that would probably start me off to
the nearest Dunkin Donuts for coffee and donuts instead of working
on my car...

As far as the leak is concerned I've heard of using chalk or baby
powder around the trunk and then looking for areas that have
been disturbed by the water.(I think tech suggested this).
The puzzling thing is that the carpet covered platform that covers
the spare tire never seems to be wet when it leaks. This sort of
points to a leak that is not around the top of the trunk seal.
I have heard of the trunk lock mechanism leaking with the water
running down the back of the trunk and into the spare tire well.
So far I have taken the trunk side and rear interior panels off,
cleared the drain tubes in the channel above the trunk, taken
the back seat out, checked the trunk side wells and vent boxes,
cleaned and checked the trunk weatherstrip, and cleaned the
trunk surfaces that contact the weatherstrip.
Fortunately the trunk well seems to be well coated so I don't
have any real rusting problems yet. But I can't say the same
for the original jack, it's a rusted mess.
As soon as I get a chance I try again. Today we have a tropical
disturbance in our area and a lot of rain so I won't be able to
do it today.

Best regards , John

 

Hi John,

>that would probably start me off to the nearest Dunkin Donuts for coffee and donuts instead of working
on my car...

Agreed.

One of my happiest moments is when I'm in a Volvo (or any fancy sedan/sports car), with a cup of coffee and at a steady cruise on an open freeway. Not to worry, in case if the coffee spills on you, we all know what to do next, don't we? Grab your phone and call your lawyer indeed....[8D]

>Today we have a tropical disturbance in our area and a lot of rain so I won't be able to do it today.

You know, something tells me that this is a great opportunity for the investigation that the entire world is watching...

You do not have to work outside ona rainy day, but you could perhaps offer some $$$ for someone and ask him/her to sleep in the trunk (depending on who you're going to ask; $300 for wife, $100 for a friend, $5 for the neighbor's kidminus $600 of damage & abuse deposit[8D]). This is called economics[8D].

Anyway, have a good weekend to All.

P.S: How did the ABS module repair go?


Kanji

 

When you open the trunk the drain holes are in the ledge at the corners by the bottom of the back window.
If they are clogged the water overflows and seeps through the gasket and into the trunk.

You might also want to check the taillight gaskets.

 

Hi Tech,

Thank you for the suggestions, I'm sure John (J. Telectro) will try them. I too, found out that the tail light lens mounting could develop a gap and allow entry of water. Even though John's 850's spare tyre well has become a fish tank, the carpet right above it doesn't seem to get wet, so I assumed that water was running down the gap between the carpet and the tail-end of the trunk.

Regards,


JPN

 

Hi tech and Kanji,

Tech it's good to see you on here, I hope things are going ok
for you. Thanks for your help. I will check what you suggested.
There has to be a leak there somewhere, I just haven't identified
it yet.
JPN said that you live over near Disney World, do you ever
have time to work on people's cars on the side?

Kanji, I still have the ABS controller off the car. The idea
you showed me of using the hinge to open it was great, but
I still am working on getting it open. I could cut it open in a
few minutes but I'd like to do it properly. The gap between
the case and the cover isn't uniform and I've been filing the
hinge to get it to fit into the gap. I'm doing it at work so I
only have a minute to work on it every now and then.
The hinge idea was a big help, at least I can get the cover
to move slightly on one side now and it looks like it should
do the trick.

Best regards, John

 

Hi John,

With Tech's suggestions, I believe the source of the leak would be found soon. If the carpet is never wet even with the water puddle, it has to be leaking from the rear of the trunk, perhaps due to undetected gap between the brake light lens and the body. This kind of problem seems to be common in Japan too.

If you get tired of cutting into the silicone resin on the ABS module, here's a method I use to force plasticor ABS materials to open. I would take an old knife I don't care about, heat it up with a cigar lighter (I never smoke, though) for a few minutes and cut through the material while the knife is hot. It melts the material as it cuts through the material, and loses heat during the process. When the knife loses heat, simply reheat it & repeat until you're done. And of course, try not to let the knife enter too deeply into the module; let the tip of the knife work it. This may not be something you can do at work, as this process creates smoke and offensive odor which is not good for your health if inhaled. The separated surface won't be even, but you can sand the mating surfaces to the bestyou can, and then apply enough silicone resin during re-assembly. You will still havesome gaps, so keep applying silicone resin untilall gaps have sealed up.Since the surface of the circuit board is covered in the same silicone resin anyway, a little bit of resindropping ontothe circuit board should not create a problem.

If your task turns out successful, which I'm sure it does, then you may be the first person to have repaired the ABS module on a '95 850 in the States. I still wonder why the "Vicrocha", the ABS repair guy, doesn't want to deal with '95 or older modules. It probably isn't profitable, I assume.

Talk to you later.


Kanji

 

Once in a while I do a little bit of side work but not all the time.
Things are getting better at home. working on slowly. Thanks for asking.

 

Hi tech and Kanji

>
Once in a while I do a little bit of side work but not all the time.
Things are getting better at home. working on slowly. Thanks for asking.<

Yes, family comes first. If you do take on outside work in the
future please keep me in mind.

I had a chance to look again for the trunk leak yesterday. I
sprayed the trunk area from the back of the car and found
that water was coming over the weatherstrip to the right of
the trunk latch. When I looked at the bottom edge of the trunk
lid I found a small chipped area in the paint and a little rust on
the metal underneath, right where the leak seemed to be. I also
noticed 1 small drop of water on the bottom of the compartment
that holds the right tail light.
I then soaked the trunk area from the front, letting the water
run down the rear window. This time I had water coming in
around trunk latch . The water seemed to be coming over the
weatherstrip and also out of a hole in the right of the channel
that holds the weatherstrip on the bottom of the trunk opening.
The leak over the weatherstrip was in a different place than
the first. Could water in that channel be from a leak in the
right tail light?
I ran water down the rear window one more time but for a
short time and didn't find any water in the trunk...until I opened
the trunk lid(!) This was more than just a couple of drops.
So far I think all of the water is coming in around the bottom
rear trunk opening, I checked all other areas in the trunk and
can't find any other leaks.
There are some nicks and cuts in the weatherstrip but they are
in the portion that fits over the lip on the trunk opening. The softer
portion is fine and the leaks do not seem to be coming from the
nicked/cut areas. I have noticed that if I push down on the trunk
when it is closed it makes a noise like rubber scritching against metal
and I can press it down slightly. Maybe I need to adjust the latch?
I did check the drains at the bottom of the rear window and they
are not clogged. I was amazed at the amount of water that can
come into that trunk from one very small leak.

Sorry, I know this was a really long post.

John

 

Where are you located?

Maybe it might be coming from the tail light and maybe not.

The latch might need to be adjusted but would probably have to see it to know for sure.

 

Hi John,

Sounds like you're getting closer in finding the source of leak.

>Where are you located?
A rare opportunity indeed. Perhaps $ for labour, a bottle of beer or two, and some goodies for Mustang would get Tech's motor going.

>Sorry, I know this was a really long post.
Check out my post in the following link; it's probably the longest post in the entire forum and I keep updating it once/2 weeks or so, or whenever I find a need to upgrade/correct the info.

https://volvoforums.com/m_48928/tm.htm

Have a good week All,


JPN

 

Hi Kanji and tech,

> A rare opportunity indeed. Perhaps $ for labour, a bottle of beer or two, and some goodies for Mustang would get Tech's motor going

LOL....I have a little money, no beer (but I could get some), and
I don't know anything about Mustang parts...

Thanks for the suggestions on the ABS Kanji, I'm still trying to
pry the box open. Unfortunately my car is not a 95,it's a 96.

> Where are you located?.
I'm across Orlando about 15-18 miles from Disney.
I'm really most interested in having someone just look the
car over and tell me what they think, if it's worth repairing or
if they see serious problems. I'm pretty sure it's going to need
a timing belt and PCV vent box and tubing. The trunk leak is just
a kind of an annoyance for the time being.
I know that you are pretty busy right now so I don't want to cause
extra trouble for you.

John

 

If you really wanted to bring it by my work for an oil change if you can spare the $$ for that. And ask for me to look at it and I will look it over really good and tell you what I think. I work in Winter Park. If you are intrested I can PM you the Phone Number for work this way you can call and make an Appt. and ask exactly how much the oil change is.

If not then maybe in the near future we can meet up at my house and I can look it over.

 

Hi tech,

Yes, PM me, I will call and find out the details.

Thanks, John