96 850 won't start
#1
96 850 won't start
I'm doing some work on a car for an elderly widow, and it's not short on problems. Earlier this year I put an alternator and coolant temp sensor in it to correct a random revving issue (coolant leaking around wires and .5vac output from the alternator). It also had a fried the starter, so that was replaced as well.
All was fine until about two months ago, when the car suddenly wouldn't start. It cranks over, but no coughing or anything. I did some testing and it has no power to the coil or fuel pump at any time. The IAC is also buzzing at all times even with the key off.
I have done a little further testing and have found no power at any pin on the fuel pump relay. I have also tried resetting the alarm system using the key fob with no change. I unfortunately only had a few hours to mess with it, and it is now 850 miles away, but I'll be back there for a few days next month. I really need to get this thing functioning as it's her only car and where she's at the nearest dealer or specialist is about 40miles away, not to mention a bit out of budget.
Any insights as to what might cause this problem would be very helpful.
All was fine until about two months ago, when the car suddenly wouldn't start. It cranks over, but no coughing or anything. I did some testing and it has no power to the coil or fuel pump at any time. The IAC is also buzzing at all times even with the key off.
I have done a little further testing and have found no power at any pin on the fuel pump relay. I have also tried resetting the alarm system using the key fob with no change. I unfortunately only had a few hours to mess with it, and it is now 850 miles away, but I'll be back there for a few days next month. I really need to get this thing functioning as it's her only car and where she's at the nearest dealer or specialist is about 40miles away, not to mention a bit out of budget.
Any insights as to what might cause this problem would be very helpful.
#2
I'm doing some work on a car for an elderly widow, and it's not short on problems. Earlier this year I put an alternator and coolant temp sensor in it to correct a random revving issue (coolant leaking around wires and .5vac output from the alternator). It also had a fried the starter, so that was replaced as well.
All was fine until about two months ago, when the car suddenly wouldn't start. It cranks over, but no coughing or anything. I did some testing and it has no power to the coil or fuel pump at any time. The IAC is also buzzing at all times even with the key off.
I have done a little further testing and have found no power at any pin on the fuel pump relay. I have also tried resetting the alarm system using the key fob with no change. I unfortunately only had a few hours to mess with it, and it is now 850 miles away, but I'll be back there for a few days next month. I really need to get this thing functioning as it's her only car and where she's at the nearest dealer or specialist is about 40miles away, not to mention a bit out of budget.
Any insights as to what might cause this problem would be very helpful.
All was fine until about two months ago, when the car suddenly wouldn't start. It cranks over, but no coughing or anything. I did some testing and it has no power to the coil or fuel pump at any time. The IAC is also buzzing at all times even with the key off.
I have done a little further testing and have found no power at any pin on the fuel pump relay. I have also tried resetting the alarm system using the key fob with no change. I unfortunately only had a few hours to mess with it, and it is now 850 miles away, but I'll be back there for a few days next month. I really need to get this thing functioning as it's her only car and where she's at the nearest dealer or specialist is about 40miles away, not to mention a bit out of budget.
Any insights as to what might cause this problem would be very helpful.
#3
#4
The ignition switch could have one of the internal contacts open and it's the one you need, it's just a guess but it's possible. Mine failed but the car would start and run I'd just have random occurrences of different idiot lights come on and my cruise would drop out. There are a few circuits going through that switch.
First picture is the ignition switch. Second is the cam sensor.
First picture is the ignition switch. Second is the cam sensor.
#5
This car has had the ignition switch replaced previously, the original wouldn't return out of the start position.
Would the cam sensor prevent the computer from turning the power on to the coil and fuel pump? I don't know how sophisticated the network is in this car or what it looks at when powered up.
Is there a test point for the key switch without tearing the column apart?
Would the cam sensor prevent the computer from turning the power on to the coil and fuel pump? I don't know how sophisticated the network is in this car or what it looks at when powered up.
Is there a test point for the key switch without tearing the column apart?
#6
This car has had the ignition switch replaced previously, the original wouldn't return out of the start position.
Would the cam sensor prevent the computer from turning the power on to the coil and fuel pump? I don't know how sophisticated the network is in this car or what it looks at when powered up.
Is there a test point for the key switch without tearing the column apart?
Would the cam sensor prevent the computer from turning the power on to the coil and fuel pump? I don't know how sophisticated the network is in this car or what it looks at when powered up.
Is there a test point for the key switch without tearing the column apart?
#8
This is the test for the Camshaft Position Sensor (CMP) out of the book.
BOSCH EZ129K
1) Disconnect coil wire from distributor cap. Put coil wire
next to ground and operate starter motor. If spark is present, check
distributor rotor and cap. If spark is not present, go to next step.
2) Connect voltmeter between ignition coil connector terminal
No. 15 (Red wire) and ground. Turn ignition on. If battery voltage is
not present, check voltage supply to ignition coil. If battery voltage
is present, turn ignition off and go to next step.
3) Connect voltmeter between ignition coil terminal No. 1
(Blue wire) and ground. Operate starter motor. If about .7-1.3 volts
are present, repeat test using new ignition coil. If about .7-1.3
volts are not present, turn ignition off and go to next step.
4) Disconnect engine speed sensor connector located close to
flywheel. Connect an ohmmeter between sensor terminals. If resistance
is about 200-400 ohms, go to next step and check Camshaft Position
Sensor (CMP) signal. If resistance is not about 200-400 ohms, replace
sensor.
NOTE: Engine speed sensor is also known as Vehicle Speed Sensor
(VSS) or impulse sensor.
5) Remove intake hose. Bend aside rubber sleeve on CMP
connector. Connect voltmeter between connector terminal No. 2 and
ground. See Fig. 4. Operate starter motor. If voltage reading varies
between 0-5 volts, go to step 7). If voltage reading does not vary
between 0-5 volts, go to next step.
Fig. 4: Identifying Camshaft Position Sensor (CMP) Terminals
Courtesy of Volvo Cars of North America.
6) Connect voltmeter between CMP connector terminal No. 3 and
ground. Turn ignition on. About 10 volts should be present. Turn
ignition off. Connect an ohmmeter between CMP connector terminal No. 1
and ground. Ohmmeter should show about zero ohms. If voltage supply
and ground are okay, repeat test using new CMP. If voltage supply and
ground are not okay, reconnect intake hose and go to step 9).
7) If voltage reading varied between 0-5 volts in step 5),
disconnect power stage connector at ignition coil. Bend back rubber
sleeve on connector. Check ground supply by connecting ohmmeter
between connector terminal No. 1 and ground. See Fig. 5. Ohmmeter
should indicate zero ohms. Check voltage supply by connecting
voltmeter between terminal No.
BOSCH EZ129K
1) Disconnect coil wire from distributor cap. Put coil wire
next to ground and operate starter motor. If spark is present, check
distributor rotor and cap. If spark is not present, go to next step.
2) Connect voltmeter between ignition coil connector terminal
No. 15 (Red wire) and ground. Turn ignition on. If battery voltage is
not present, check voltage supply to ignition coil. If battery voltage
is present, turn ignition off and go to next step.
3) Connect voltmeter between ignition coil terminal No. 1
(Blue wire) and ground. Operate starter motor. If about .7-1.3 volts
are present, repeat test using new ignition coil. If about .7-1.3
volts are not present, turn ignition off and go to next step.
4) Disconnect engine speed sensor connector located close to
flywheel. Connect an ohmmeter between sensor terminals. If resistance
is about 200-400 ohms, go to next step and check Camshaft Position
Sensor (CMP) signal. If resistance is not about 200-400 ohms, replace
sensor.
NOTE: Engine speed sensor is also known as Vehicle Speed Sensor
(VSS) or impulse sensor.
5) Remove intake hose. Bend aside rubber sleeve on CMP
connector. Connect voltmeter between connector terminal No. 2 and
ground. See Fig. 4. Operate starter motor. If voltage reading varies
between 0-5 volts, go to step 7). If voltage reading does not vary
between 0-5 volts, go to next step.
Fig. 4: Identifying Camshaft Position Sensor (CMP) Terminals
Courtesy of Volvo Cars of North America.
6) Connect voltmeter between CMP connector terminal No. 3 and
ground. Turn ignition on. About 10 volts should be present. Turn
ignition off. Connect an ohmmeter between CMP connector terminal No. 1
and ground. Ohmmeter should show about zero ohms. If voltage supply
and ground are okay, repeat test using new CMP. If voltage supply and
ground are not okay, reconnect intake hose and go to step 9).
7) If voltage reading varied between 0-5 volts in step 5),
disconnect power stage connector at ignition coil. Bend back rubber
sleeve on connector. Check ground supply by connecting ohmmeter
between connector terminal No. 1 and ground. See Fig. 5. Ohmmeter
should indicate zero ohms. Check voltage supply by connecting
voltmeter between terminal No.
#9
Thanks for the help, but I have already confirmed that there is no power getting to the coil or fuel pump at any time so this looks like it's not the CPS. This car had the ignition switch replaced once, it was done at a dealership so I'm assuming it was an OEM part, rather than an aftermarket one. It's starting to look like this may have failed again though, aside from never getting power anywhere on the fuel pump relay.
Is there a main relay that provides power to the fuel pump relay, or does the input for that come straight from the battery?
Is there a main relay that provides power to the fuel pump relay, or does the input for that come straight from the battery?
#10
Thanks for the help, but I have already confirmed that there is no power getting to the coil or fuel pump at any time so this looks like it's not the CPS. This car had the ignition switch replaced once, it was done at a dealership so I'm assuming it was an OEM part, rather than an aftermarket one. It's starting to look like this may have failed again though, aside from never getting power anywhere on the fuel pump relay.
Is there a main relay that provides power to the fuel pump relay, or does the input for that come straight from the battery?
Is there a main relay that provides power to the fuel pump relay, or does the input for that come straight from the battery?
I have schematics for a 95; imagine it's same for '96 too, at least with regards to this circuit..
So first thing to ck is for pwr (12v) at fuse #2 in the fuse box in left (driver's side in USA model) rear corner under the hood; should be hot in RUN and START key positions. It supplies pwr to both ignition coil and fuel pump relay. I am guessing it's dead.
Assuming that's true (no pwr at fuse #2) then move on to Overload Relay 15+ in same fuse box (but have to remove bigger panel to access it; torx screws). See attached pic; this relay is just forward of fuel pump relay and toward passengers side.
Now pull this relay and ck for pwr at pin 86 (in relay socket) with key in RUN and START positions. If you don't see pwr, then ignition switch is bad or wiring to it.
If you do see pwr on pin 86 socket then most likely relay is bad. Verify by bypassing pins 30 and 87 in relay socket (use fairly heavy gauge wire) and see if car will now start. Replace relay w/new part.
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